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Offline Matt_HTopic starter

Overtaxing PSU?
« on: April 23, 2014, 03:18:32 AM »
Hello all,

Having some trouble with my 4000T and I'm beginning to suspect it's the power supply. The PSU is fairly new and hasn't been used much, so it shouldn't be worn out at this point, but I'm wondering if it's just not powerful enough. My previous supply was 300W, which I thought was overkill, so when I found a replacement that was 230W I figured it would be okay. Perhaps not.

In short, do you think 230W is enough to power...?
4000T motherboard
CSPPC + replacement fan
5 Zorro cards
2 CD drives
1 (10,000 RPM SCSI) hard drive
1 floppy drive
1 case fan with LEDs

Symptoms are some slight instability, hard drive sometimes seems to stop and start spinning, trouble reading CDs. These seem to clear up if I disconnect a few things. Basically just looking to get some confirmation from the experts here before I plunk down $30 on a more powerful PSU :)

Thanks!
 

Offline danbeaver

Re: Overtaxing PSU?
« Reply #1 on: April 23, 2014, 04:34:40 AM »
Even the new AT PSU's can fail.  While a more robust 300 or 400W AT PSU can be found on the web, you may want to check out your 230W  supply (which should be adequate for your hardware)  to make sure the voltage is constant under load without ripples and drop outs.  This problems will cause odd failures that are unpredictable.  Except for the mostly unused -12V line, an ATX PSU can be modified to supply the power and the mATX ones can fit into an AT style PSU box so the hardware lines up with the mountings.
 

Offline Matt_HTopic starter

Re: Overtaxing PSU?
« Reply #2 on: April 23, 2014, 11:42:27 PM »
Quote from: danbeaver;763123
Even the new AT PSU's can fail.  While a more robust 300 or 400W AT PSU can be found on the web, you may want to check out your 230W  supply (which should be adequate for your hardware)  to make sure the voltage is constant under load without ripples and drop outs.  This problems will cause odd failures that are unpredictable.  Except for the mostly unused -12V line, an ATX PSU can be modified to supply the power and the mATX ones can fit into an AT style PSU box so the hardware lines up with the mountings.


Hmm, either way I'd be looking at a new PSU... may as well go for the drop-in AT replacement...
 

Offline QuikSanz

Re: Overtaxing PSU?
« Reply #3 on: April 24, 2014, 12:11:36 AM »
Hmm, at 115V AC, US power voltage, that's a whole 2 amps. This may not be enough for a PPC card and you other cards/expansions. I may be tempted to go with a 350Watt to be sure is has a bit to spare.

Chris
 

Offline danbeaver

Re: Overtaxing PSU?
« Reply #4 on: April 24, 2014, 01:48:06 AM »
Quote from: QuikSanz;763170
Hmm, at 115V AC, US power voltage, that's a whole 2 amps. This may not be enough for a PPC card and you other cards/expansions. I may be tempted to go with a 350Watt to be sure is has a bit to spare.

Chris
Really?  I have an A4000D with CSPPC, two UWSCSI drives, DVD-R/W, Mediator with Radeon 9200, SB128, RTL8139, and Spider USB on the standard 140W PSU running for years without problems.  I never knew it was under powered.
 

Offline QuikSanz

Re: Overtaxing PSU?
« Reply #5 on: April 24, 2014, 03:09:19 AM »
The newer ones are not what they used to be. Switching types seem to be less efficient at higher output %. not sure.

Chris

Edited
« Last Edit: April 24, 2014, 03:20:06 AM by QuikSanz »
 

Offline Matt_HTopic starter

Re: Overtaxing PSU?
« Reply #6 on: April 24, 2014, 03:25:18 AM »
350W AT supplies seem to be a bit hard to find, unfortunately, but 300W ones are readily available.

Dan, it doesn't surprise me that your original PSU is still working. I think Chris is spot on that they don't make 'em like they used to. There isn't exactly much of a competitive market incentive for high build quality in AT PSUs these days :). My 4000T's original PSU lasted from manufacture in 1996 until 2007 under a slightly lighter load, and I think it was 200W. The 300W replacement lasted 2007 until 2012 or 2013, and now it looks like the current 230W may be scrap-ready after only a few weeks of active use (though it's been physically installed longer).

I wonder if I should get 2 new ones so I have a spare...
 

Offline QuikSanz

Re: Overtaxing PSU?
« Reply #7 on: April 24, 2014, 03:48:28 AM »
The old ones are brick's, if you still have one send it to that recap guy.

Chris
 

Offline danbeaver

Re: Overtaxing PSU?
« Reply #8 on: April 24, 2014, 10:13:26 PM »
Well only a few of the old ones for the A4000D seem unbreakable, I've repaired 4 that were bricks, in that they were dead as one.  My local TV repair guy wants $25 to recap them, but I can get a new mATX 500W off stupidBay for $24.95 that are dual voltage with silent fans and pop them in the original PSU case in 30 minutes looking exactly like the original.  I did beef up my main A4000T with a 400W exact replacement AT, for bragging rights, but it was pulling a lot of weight and doing just fine.  I have tons of nice things to say about the design of the A4KT case, PSU, and motherboard with only the center drive cage being a pain due to the cross bars and need to remove the 2 short+long cables for access.
 

Offline Matt_HTopic starter

Re: Overtaxing PSU?
« Reply #9 on: May 04, 2014, 11:13:09 PM »
Circling back to this, I was all ready to install a new 300W PSU until I discovered that it did not include a grounding screw. Probably not a huge deal, but there seemed to be some build quality issues with the unit to begin with, so I didn't want to take any chances. Did some more testing with the existing 230W unit, rebalanced the power load across the leads, and things seem to be ok for now. Hopefully I can return the new PSU to the store...

As to the trouble reading CDs that I mentioned in my first post, it looks like that was a problem with a particular CD. Silly me thinking a recent, commercially-masted CD would behave properly. :) Now the even more ironic part: it was OS4.1 Classic. Anyway, made a copy of the disc on another machine and the copy behaved correctly in the 4000T.

Now to start a new thread for the OS4 problems I'm having... ;)
 

Offline danbeaver

Re: Overtaxing PSU?
« Reply #10 on: May 05, 2014, 12:43:27 AM »
Look in the http://WWW.Forum.Hyperion-Entertainment.biz forums under "Classics" for help with OS4.1 for help with installation, optimization, and such.  I've found it to be helpful!
« Last Edit: May 05, 2014, 12:44:29 AM by danbeaver »