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Author Topic: Natami started and stopped again  (Read 9482 times)

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Offline ElPolloDiablTopic starter

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Natami started and stopped again
« on: April 16, 2014, 08:34:36 AM »
The Natami project started and stopped again.

Link:
http://www.natami.net/knowledge.php

Sounds like he has given up for good this time. Please don't say anything nasty yet just in case he is testing us.

There is also AROS68k news there.

edit:
It is actually a different system that was cancelled. Natami is still where it was.
« Last Edit: April 16, 2014, 10:47:20 AM by ElPolloDiabl »
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Offline Lurch

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Re: Natami started and stopped again
« Reply #1 on: April 16, 2014, 08:42:35 AM »
Natami is a great idea, after looking at a few photos of it, it seemed it was nearing some release point.
Then nothing for a long time, but I'm not disappointed. With most things Amiga I don't hold my breath anymore. If it does appear then that's great, but will just read things these days and go oh that interesting and carry on.
FPGA Acrade is were my money will most likely go. I'd love to buy it with the 060 daughter board all in one hit, but don't think that's going to be possible.
I could see it as a replacement for my A1200 one day.
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Offline Cosmos

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Re: Natami started and stopped again
« Reply #2 on: April 16, 2014, 08:57:53 AM »
Very sad news...

My advice to the team is : find the a lot of money before starting anything...

I wrote a blog on simple hardware Amiga Classics hacks during about 3 years with zero money, and I cannot do anything seriously...

Money is a locomotive, despite you are agree or not : it's like that in our dying world...


;-(

Offline Lurch

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Re: Natami started and stopped again
« Reply #3 on: April 16, 2014, 09:16:43 AM »
Always said if I wont lotto (11mil this weekend) I'd like to invest in something Amiga. But winning is the hard part :-/

There are some very rich people in the world, worth billions. I'm sure a couple of million would go unnoticed to them, just they have no interest.
I could do with a million for my personal life ;-)
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Offline wawrzon

Re: Natami started and stopped again
« Reply #4 on: April 16, 2014, 09:33:36 AM »
Quote from: ElPolloDiabl;762645
The Natami project started and stopped again.

Link:
http://www.natami.net/knowledge.php

Sounds like he has given up for good this time. Please don't say anything nasty yet just in case he is testing us.

There is also AROS68k news there.


but this is a completely different project that just happens to have been discussed on natami forum, right? i just guess as i dont visit there and i wonder why anyone still would. also no wonder someone has abandoned a barely started project, that happens all the time. only projects that have a slight chance are open community efforts.
 

Offline Astral

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Re: Natami started and stopped again
« Reply #5 on: April 16, 2014, 10:18:31 AM »
Quote from: Lurch;762652
Always said if I wont lotto (11mil this weekend) I'd like to invest in something Amiga. But winning is the hard part :-/

There are some very rich people in the world, worth billions. I'm sure a couple of million would go unnoticed to them, just they have no interest.
I could do with a million for my personal life ;-)


Quite the contrary I believe. Most wealthy people (who have generated their own wealth - not just "won" it) are wealthy because they value a $...or a million$'s. They don't just "not care where it goes" :D

In saying that I agree that for the most part "they have no interest", as you say. If only there was a wealthy potential investor who could see a modern day rebirth of the Amiga, and who is interested in doing so, and actually DOES IT. Kind of like Trevor Dickinson - he is a business person and an enthusiast. He has his plan, and he is on the way - and I wish him every success. BUT, I don't believe his product is a "modern" system with the essence of the original Amiga. On the other hand, if there was someone who's business plan was to build a modern Amiga in the form of the Natami, and executed that plan, that would probably have a better chance of success. And by success I mean to make Amiga P O P U L A R again :D

Thing is, given there are now 85 trillion variations of the Amiga, with it's carcass spread across all kinds of interpretations, it would be extremely difficult to bring it all together to monopolise on one particular variation of it - and at the same time legally limit every other incarnation possible. Which to me would be necessary to succeed.

The Natami IS the S*&T!

I for one would abso-friggin-lutely love to see the Natami finished!
 

Offline ElPolloDiablTopic starter

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Re: Natami started and stopped again
« Reply #6 on: April 16, 2014, 10:31:01 AM »
Re: the super aga part. This has already been done by rtg. Why do we need something Amiga pure?
He has some good design goals. Others are a bit off, including the expected retail sales.

edit:
The project that was cancelled was different system. An attempt at a more powerful system. so Natami is still in Prototype phase, not cancelled.
« Last Edit: April 16, 2014, 10:46:19 AM by ElPolloDiabl »
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Offline Astral

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Re: Natami started and stopped again
« Reply #7 on: April 16, 2014, 11:10:04 AM »
Quote from: ElPolloDiabl;762657
Re: the super aga part. This has already been done by rtg. Why do we need something Amiga pure?


Because it's not backwards hardware compatible. (Whether that's practical or not is another thing).
 

Offline Hattig

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Re: Natami started and stopped again
« Reply #8 on: April 16, 2014, 11:48:44 AM »
The NatAmi Forums are still used? Crikey. They've been a massive source of hot air for years.
 

Offline NovaCoder

Re: Natami started and stopped again
« Reply #9 on: April 16, 2014, 12:27:21 PM »
The main problem with Natami project has always been that it was too ambitious.

The whole point behind and FPGA design is that it can be updated after it's been released.

1) Design a board with a big fat FPGA chip and a reasonable amount of memory
2) Replicate the standard chipset and a basic 68k chip.
3) Open Source the cores
4) Sell the board with a nice little custom retro case
5) Get clever people to enhance the core for free and add all the funky features
6) Drink lots of beer to celebrate


Easy :)
Life begins at 100 MIPS!


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Offline psxphill

Re: Natami started and stopped again
« Reply #10 on: April 16, 2014, 01:26:30 PM »
Quote from: NovaCoder;762662
The main problem with Natami project has always been that it was too ambitious.

Yeah I agree. People get in their heads that on their own they are going to take on Arm/Motorola/Intel/IBM if they spend months designing something sort of like Amiga but different.
 
If you just work on making something Amiga compatible first then the project will go much better.
 

Offline Duce

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Re: Natami started and stopped again
« Reply #11 on: April 16, 2014, 01:40:20 PM »
The Super AGA, which was a dumb idea to begin with and we would have seen a dozen - at best, programs ever take use of it, was too lofty to begin with.  Anyone that lusted over the Natami hardware spec thinking that suddenly a limited run, homebrew piece of Amiga hardware would suddenly get coders like Psygnosis back on the platform recoding their golden era gems in "SOOPER AGA!" was a fool.  Twenty years too late.  I can install a 'hemi in my VW Beetle, but it's still a bloody Beetle in the end :)

Super AGA would have been relegated to crap like a more modern port of Tuxcart for Natami from OS4/MOS and nothing more.  No one would have suddenly started started coding barn burning, must have games that would have all the CoD junkies a twitching.

The worst thing about the "NG" Amiga scene is the "port" cruft/creep you get.  Terrible ports of Tuxcart and other silly Linux games that try to show off some astounding power, but they really just show off that a crappy game can be "ported" to a virtually redundant hobby system.  Natami wouldn't have been any different.  If you code "Amiga" programs that are just dodgy Linux ports depending on all sorts of other crap installed to get working, I loathe you :)

I'm sure someone could invent a toaster that gives me a foot massage, but no one is because it's stupid, lol.

Had they used their skills within a narrower scope and just made a really well made FPGA AGA/RTG machine, it would have been finished and we'd all own one by now.
« Last Edit: April 16, 2014, 01:51:48 PM by Duce »
 

Offline wawrzon

Re: Natami started and stopped again
« Reply #12 on: April 16, 2014, 04:16:36 PM »
well, right..

the comunity should concentrate on first things.
 
instead of superaga a proper aga reimplementation in fpga and beyond that cgx/p96 compatible graphics like it apparently is taking shape on fpga arcade.

in parallel development of accelerating solutions, be it fpga or emulation on faster cpus as cards for existing systems (might be easier for the time being except for bus interface) or standalone.

softwarewise a reimplemented open source system like aros68k plus individual libraries reimplemented and improved in asm as it is happening already.

proceeding like that there is some actual progress..
 

Offline NorthWay

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Re: Natami started and stopped again
« Reply #13 on: April 16, 2014, 04:28:07 PM »
Quote from: NovaCoder;762662
The main problem with Natami project has always been that it was too ambitious.

Yep, just like AROS was pie-in-the-sky until they came to their senses and targeted 3.1. Get that done and you can add new stuff.

I'm still sitting pretty and waiting for the FPGAArcade (and it is getting so close you can practically smell it), and I hope we will see some thriving developments there.
 

Offline IanP

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Re: Natami started and stopped again
« Reply #14 on: April 16, 2014, 07:48:15 PM »
Natami did have a phased approach to development. The first prototype "Natami 30" was an add on for a modified C-One, their was a Zorro graphics card for the 3D core, Natami LX prototype, Natami MX prototype and two 68060 expansion boards.

Not enhancing the graphics to some degree would have been crazy when the idea of Natami was to provide a practical system for use as a main computer in the modern world (not outperforming the latest PCs just capable of doing the basics). There were some crazy performance claims being made by an individual  member of the team for the soft core 68K processor and graphics, apparently without consultation with hardware designer Thomas Hirsch and this I believe led  to the break-up of the team. With nothing more heard of the hardware in the intervening years I can only assume Thomas lost interest in the project. It's a shame as the hardware looked very promising and a lot of money and effort must have gone into the project. The "project" by Harold Neufeldt also made some very dubious claims and without anything like the tangible evidence of it being realistic that the Natami hardware had.