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Old 01-10-2013, 04:27 PM   #1
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Default Amiga setup "woes," possible change-up ahead...

I have had some kind of Amiga most of the years over the past 28 years. Usually more than one.

I currently have:

-- An Amiga 1000 system:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/blakesp...7621596272210/
-- An Amiga 2000 '060 system w/ Picasso II:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/blakesp...7604299491786/
-- An Amiga 1200 '060 tower:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/blakesp...7604300573758/
-- A SAM 440epFlex:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/blakesp...7621877406693/

But things are not ideal. I am thinking of selling and re-purchasing.

I love the Amiga 1000 and will never let that go. It's a nice little setup with 2MB FAST and a SCSI HD and is great with 1.3 on down.

The A1200 '060 was my main machine, but it started having issues with the Indivision AGA and so I had to drop back to the more limited FF I had before (Cammy inherited it!). And I have PSU issues, and being towered it's started to feel sort of not deeply Amiga. And, it has OS 3.9 on it which I dislike. I am trying to get the PSU issue fixed and then I may sell, maybe in parts. More on why later.

Then there is the A2000 '060. Lately I have spent all this time building up my A2000 with '060, Picasso II, etc. but it seems misguided. I wanted to use the Amiga 2000 for all kinds of things like IRC and terminal and web etc. but it's not nearly as practical as the SAM. And I'm having some compat issues with '060 on some apps. It's got lots of good stuff in it, ADSG dual serial, etc. but it feels like I've built it out beyond reason. It feels less good than it did when it was an '020 or a '000.

I love the SAM. Will keep and explore AmigaOS 4 onward.

I think what I want, in the end, replacing the A2000 and A1200, is a proper A1200 in its own case with an accelerator like the new 42MHz 030 on that white circuit board, with the fast memory. Something clean that I can attach a CF card to and and Indivision mk II to and have a great WHDLoad experience.

I am thinking I might be better off with a PAL unit, even tho I am in the states, looking at the games and demos out there. A friend just got a NIB A1200 on eBay. How often do they come along?

What do you think of my plan?




bp
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Last edited by blakespot; 01-10-2013 at 04:34 PM..
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Old 01-10-2013, 06:05 PM   #2
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Default Re: Amiga setup "woes," possible change-up ahead...

I was thinking of going for a tower setup but budget and a few other things I've decided not to go any further.

Going to concentrate on getting a 030 1200 in it's original wedge going. Although have been tempted to buy a 060 but the price has always been outside me reach, but we'll see what happens this year :-)

The ACA1231 is very quick though, I was impressed when I did have it running. Although my 1200 didn't like it so it's off getting fixed at the moment.

Thought about the ACA1232 but not fast enough, plus 64MB was more than enough for me.
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Old 01-11-2013, 12:27 PM   #3
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Default Re: Amiga setup "woes," possible change-up ahead...

Quote:
Originally Posted by blakespot View Post
I have had some kind of Amiga most of the years over the past 28 years. Usually more than one.

I currently have:

-- An Amiga 1000 system:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/blakesp...7621596272210/
-- An Amiga 2000 '060 system w/ Picasso II:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/blakesp...7604299491786/
-- An Amiga 1200 '060 tower:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/blakesp...7604300573758/
-- A SAM 440epFlex:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/blakesp...7621877406693/

But things are not ideal. I am thinking of selling and re-purchasing.

I love the Amiga 1000 and will never let that go. It's a nice little setup with 2MB FAST and a SCSI HD and is great with 1.3 on down.

The A1200 '060 was my main machine, but it started having issues with the Indivision AGA and so I had to drop back to the more limited FF I had before (Cammy inherited it!). And I have PSU issues, and being towered it's started to feel sort of not deeply Amiga. And, it has OS 3.9 on it which I dislike. I am trying to get the PSU issue fixed and then I may sell, maybe in parts. More on why later.

Then there is the A2000 '060. Lately I have spent all this time building up my A2000 with '060, Picasso II, etc. but it seems misguided. I wanted to use the Amiga 2000 for all kinds of things like IRC and terminal and web etc. but it's not nearly as practical as the SAM. And I'm having some compat issues with '060 on some apps. It's got lots of good stuff in it, ADSG dual serial, etc. but it feels like I've built it out beyond reason. It feels less good than it did when it was an '020 or a '000.

I love the SAM. Will keep and explore AmigaOS 4 onward.

I think what I want, in the end, replacing the A2000 and A1200, is a proper A1200 in its own case with an accelerator like the new 42MHz 030 on that white circuit board, with the fast memory. Something clean that I can attach a CF card to and and Indivision mk II to and have a great WHDLoad experience.

I am thinking I might be better off with a PAL unit, even tho I am in the states, looking at the games and demos out there. A friend just got a NIB A1200 on eBay. How often do they come along?

What do you think of my plan?




bp
You have missed the one logical,reliable machine. the A4000 or 4000T. other than caps, this is the full 32bit machine with proper z3 expansion bus,and unlike the 2000 with slow zorro2,you get better speed on gfx cards etc. I love the 2000 but its not the most logical machine to do with 060 since zorro2 is so slow(2-3MB/s). Unlike the 1200 it wont be dongled to death(generally) and need a immediate psu upgrade etc. A fully expanded 1200 will still be slower than the full expanded 4000 generally.

I love all amiga's but it still puzzles me why people build on the 1200 as a base.Its not cheaper in the long run and many times not as reliable,and certainly not as fast as the expanded 4k. I have probably opened pandoras box saying this
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Old 01-11-2013, 01:00 PM   #4
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Default Re: Amiga setup "woes," possible change-up ahead...

You won't get any disagreement from me. The cool factor of the keyboard sized unit goes away with all the bricks and cables attached to it.

A basic 4000D doesn't cost much and it's already the equivalent of an 040 expanded 1200.
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Old 01-11-2013, 01:40 PM   #5
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Default Re: Amiga setup "woes," possible change-up ahead...

I have just treated the A1200 with an Indivision AGA MkII. It was great to get a perfect picture. I also got a ps2 mouse converter and are now using an optic mouse. Quite a change from fighting the worn out mechanical mouse from the 90ties.
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Old 01-11-2013, 02:58 PM   #6
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Default Re: Amiga setup "woes," possible change-up ahead...

Quote:
Originally Posted by mechy View Post
...I love all amiga's but it still puzzles me why people build on the 1200 as a base.Its not cheaper in the long run and many times not as reliable,and certainly not as fast as the expanded 4k. I have probably opened pandoras box saying this
I had always heard that the A1200 is a more stable, compatible machine. That the extra hardware in the A4000 pushes it further afield from the center of compatibility.

Is that not the case? And how bad _are_ the caps in the A4000? I've got a room full of computers...

http://www.bytecellar.com/photo_pano.html

...and I've never, ever had a caps issue in any of them.




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Old 01-11-2013, 03:09 PM   #7
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Default Re: Amiga setup "woes," possible change-up ahead...

Personally I haven't had a cap related failure even though I've had a decent number of big box Amigas.

It's anecdotal evidence, but I just thought I'd point that I believe the cap issue to be real, but less rampant and devastating than searches might lead you to believe.

You only hear the complaints, never the ones that have no problems.

As for compatibility, I'm not the best to answer because I don't play stacks of games. I've never hit anything that caused me a problem though.

In the end you're using the computer you are emotionally attached to, not the one that lasts the longest, costs the least or runs the fastest.

Go with your gut on what you really want.
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Old 01-11-2013, 03:36 PM   #8
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Default Re: Amiga setup "woes," possible change-up ahead...

My biggest regret was selling my sam440ep really miss that system.
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Old 01-12-2013, 12:04 AM   #9
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Default Re: Amiga setup "woes," possible change-up ahead...

Nice room full of computers. I especially like the Gravis Ultrasound nailed to the wall .

One day I have to at least get my pile of Amiga's on a desk or two. I don't even have a single one set up yet. I can't imagine getting a whole room set up with that much awesome stuff though. Awesome.
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Old 01-12-2013, 07:11 AM   #10
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Default Re: Amiga setup "woes," possible change-up ahead...

@ blakespot

awesome computer room!

+1 on the Amiga 1000 as I'll always keep mine no matter what.

personally I have no interest in towering my A1200 since I got my OS4.1 machine back in 2009 & more recently upgraded to my X1000. I still have my 1200 Desktop with Blizzard though.
I also have my original A500 mint but just don't have the space to set it up ..yet
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Old 01-12-2013, 08:04 AM   #11
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Default Re: Amiga setup "woes," possible change-up ahead...

Ohh Gravis ultrasound, how nice did not the background music in Doom sound on it! The electric guitar did pop out great with a gravis!
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Old 01-12-2013, 08:09 AM   #12
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Default Re: Amiga setup "woes," possible change-up ahead...

Quote:
Originally Posted by mechy View Post
You have missed the one logical,reliable machine. the A4000 or 4000T. other than caps, this is the full 32bit machine with proper z3 expansion bus,and unlike the 2000 with slow zorro2,you get better speed on gfx cards etc. I love the 2000 but its not the most logical machine to do with 060 since zorro2 is so slow(2-3MB/s). Unlike the 1200 it wont be dongled to death(generally) and need a immediate psu upgrade etc. A fully expanded 1200 will still be slower than the full expanded 4000 generally.

I love all amiga's but it still puzzles me why people build on the 1200 as a base.Its not cheaper in the long run and many times not as reliable,and certainly not as fast as the expanded 4k. I have probably opened pandoras box saying this
just curious...an sorry to interrupt ..your coment about a4000 would be faster than a a1200 ...question..if ur just using the aga chipset an the cpu is the same an memory is the same ..would that be the case?
with a graphics card id agree ..with aga why would it be different..
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Old 01-12-2013, 08:58 AM   #13
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Default Re: Amiga setup "woes," possible change-up ahead...

Quote:
Originally Posted by AAACHIPSET View Post
just curious...an sorry to interrupt ..your coment about a4000 would be faster than a a1200 ...question..if ur just using the aga chipset an the cpu is the same an memory is the same ..would that be the case?
with a graphics card id agree ..with aga why would it be different..
all things being equal with aga,ram,cpu yes they would roughly be the same speed on aga but to compare that it means a expanded 1200 vs a stock 4000.but when i refer to speed i also include the IDE. the 1200 ide is slow and unbuffered,the 4000 ide is buffered and marginally faster out of the box.
The 4000 has the fastest accelerators,cyberstorm MK3 and the PPC cards. The scsi on these cards does around 35MB/s while the fastest 1200 card with scsi can manage 10MB/s not to mention the 604e on the cyberstorm vs the 603 on the blizzard-there is a good bit of difference there. It just makes good sense to build on a good base.
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Old 01-12-2013, 03:59 PM   #14
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Default Re: Amiga setup "woes," possible change-up ahead...

Would like to agree about the 4000 being a better option over the 1200. But cost wise a 4000 is a lot more expensive.

I've yet to find a 4000 machine that was a good price, locally they're very rare.

1200 is usually around $80-$150 NZD
4000 is usually around $500 + NZD

I've always wanted a 4000 but 1200's are easy to get a hold of, and addon cards are usually cheaper and easier to find too.
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Old 01-12-2013, 08:22 PM   #15
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Default Re: Amiga setup "woes," possible change-up ahead...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lurch View Post
Would like to agree about the 4000 being a better option over the 1200. But cost wise a 4000 is a lot more expensive.

I've yet to find a 4000 machine that was a good price, locally they're very rare.

1200 is usually around $80-$150 NZD
4000 is usually around $500 + NZD

I've always wanted a 4000 but 1200's are easy to get a hold of, and addon cards are usually cheaper and easier to find too.

1200 is not cheaper, another misconception.. you didn't do a fair comparison. With the stock 4000 you get a 040/25,good power supply,expansion bus,room for 16mb ram,place for a cdrom,place for a second floppy or card reader.

add those upgrades to a 1200 and you have probabaly equalled the price or surpassed it.Remember the 1200 is 020EC,2mb ram,bad psu,no easy external expansions,no expansion bus for slots unless you tower it and its still not zorro3.The pcmcia is the only big +.

sorry to hijacking your thread Blakespot!
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Old 01-12-2013, 10:04 PM   #16
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Smile Re: Amiga setup "woes," possible change-up ahead...

I've been an owner of Amigas since 1986 and just recently built out a couple of A3000's; the A4000Ts I own are fast, stable, expandable and were built to be that way. The A500, A600, and A1200 were built with a trap door to add memory and a clock; everything else is kludge. I love my A4000's and can't wait to sell off my other machines. If you want a stable gaming machine then get an A2000, pop in a few items like an SCSI controller, one of Mech's card readers, and run the 4 GBs of WHDLoad ECS games out there. There are only around 100 AGA games and most I've checked have ECS counterparts. 8)
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Old 01-12-2013, 11:04 PM   #17
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Default Re: Amiga setup "woes," possible change-up ahead...

I have say, thats room its most better i see in years.

Congratulations, wherever be the owner...
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Old 01-13-2013, 06:58 AM   #18
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Default Re: Amiga setup "woes," possible change-up ahead...

Quote:
Originally Posted by blakespot View Post
.. And how bad _are_ the caps in the A4000? I've got a room full of computers...

http://www.bytecellar.com/photo_pano.html

...and I've never, ever had a caps issue in any of them.
bp
Wow I strongly suggest you open up each case (well at least save the Amiga's :-) & examine each cap for leakage right away.

I lost my A1200 IDE port last year because a cap right next to it slowly leaked and destroyed a bunch of traces beneath it ! It took a while to get her sorted out so do yourself a favour and replace them caps now & save yourself alot of headaches
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Old 01-13-2013, 01:16 PM   #19
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Default Re: Amiga setup "woes," possible change-up ahead...

Quote:
Originally Posted by klx300r View Post
Wow I strongly suggest you open up each case (well at least save the Amiga's :-) & examine each cap for leakage right away.

I lost my A1200 IDE port last year because a cap right next to it slowly leaked and destroyed a bunch of traces beneath it ! It took a while to get her sorted out so do yourself a favour and replace them caps now & save yourself alot of headaches
I just opened my Amiga 1000. No leaky caps. It's one of the oldest machines here. Why do I not have caps problems? Is everyone else?



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Old 01-13-2013, 02:06 PM   #20
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Default Re: Amiga setup "woes," possible change-up ahead...

I also have a bunch of computers
of various vintage -- Amigas being my favorite. Other than leaky, corrosive barrel-style batteries on every single machine that had those (get them out of there now!), I have had leaking caps on three machines. Two were AGA-era Amiga and one is a Mac SE/30.

My original Amiga 1200 (purchased new in February 1993) lost its sound because of leaking caps. At the time AmigaKit was selling replacement motherboards so that was the easiest fix. A1200 with second motherboard is still running stong.

My Amiga 4000 desktop (purchased used a few years ago) had bad battery damage but it was leaking caps that eventually disabled the motherboard. I bought a replacement used motherboard from an A.org user and it too had similar damage from leaking caps. It looked a little better, so I sent it to the man in France for some solder surgery. It's working just fine now, but not without some serious money being thrown at getting it going again.

The SE/30 stopped booting but I cleaned up the cap leakage as best I can. Still boots, but sound is very diminished. I have a kit of replacement caps, but they are too tiny for my terrible soldering skills.

My ECS and OCS-era Amigas have never had leaking cap problems -- just batteries. But with AGA Amigas, I'd keep an eye on those motherboards.

For Blake's purposes, I think an Amiga 1200 in the wedge with a new 030 accelerator and Indivision for a nice WHDLoad machine is a good idea. Or reduce the A2000 expansions to the point where it is a reliable, nice WHDLoad machine. AmigaKit's PCMCI network card offerings will get you online for IRC.... or just stick to the Sam for that. (I have a Sam440 and an X1000 and love both dearly.)

My own current classic Amiga project is a 2000/060 that has a MegaChip, Indivision ECS, Deneb (machine boots from USB sticks) and Video Toaster and Flyer cards. It has turned into a FrankenAmiga for sure, but I am having fun playing with the Flyer for edititing standard-def video footage.

I am on IRC with my A1200 right now, and I like to keep that machine simple. I do not consider it a FrankenAmiga. But I like both approaches.

Last edited by mbrantley; 01-13-2013 at 02:10 PM..
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