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Old 11-12-2012, 04:21 AM   #41
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Default Re: New project for the benefit of all classic computing!

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Originally Posted by Thorham View Post
Yuk, membrane keyboards Isn't it time our Amigas got quality mechanical keyboards with Cherry MX switches?
10000% agree!

Membrane keyboards are horrifically antiergonomical and evil.

Certain A2000 keyboards came with Cherry Black switches. ahhhhh what a joy to type on.

Sadly, no A3000 or A4000 keyboards came with Cherry switches and the A3000 diabolically evil membrane keyboards in particular were prone to failure after some years.

I would like to propose as a project that you produce an AMIGA keyboard using uniform 45g Topre switches and a PS/2 interface. You could sell a lot of these to nonamiga users too because normal Topre keyboards have been rigged by the manufacturer to NOT WORK with PS/2.

I have spent all week trying to buy a $300.00 Topre keyboard but Japan Inc. just won't sell me one. They will sell me several different models of Topre keyboards but they are all USB and have been sabotaged to not work with a PS/2 adapter.

I have had a PS/2 adapter on several of my Amigas since 1990s and I want to buy a couple of Topre keyboards for them. Grrr. Looks like I am stuck buying and trying Cherry Reds instead. I will probably end up spending $2000.00 on different keyboards since nobody will make the consumer what the consumer actually wants.
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Old 11-12-2012, 04:48 AM   #42
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Default Re: New project for the benefit of all classic computing!

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Originally Posted by Lord Aga View Post
Do you mean complete new keyboards altogether ? Or to modify the existing ones ?
New ones. Amiga keyboards suck.

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Originally Posted by ChaosLord View Post
Membrane keyboards are horrifically antiergonomical and evil.
Membrane and rubber dome keyboards are a load of crap

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I would like to propose as a project that you produce an AMIGA keyboard using uniform 45g Topre switches and a PS/2 interface.
Topre is expensive, and Cherry MX switches are fine.

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Looks like I am stuck buying and trying Cherry Reds instead.
Nothing wrong with Cherry.
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Old 11-12-2012, 04:55 AM   #43
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Default Re: New project for the benefit of all classic computing!

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Originally Posted by Thorham View Post
New ones. Amiga keyboards suck.
That's fine with me, but they must have Amiga keys layout. No PC keyboards with stickers and adapters. If it's gonna be done, it has to be done right
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Old 11-12-2012, 05:01 AM   #44
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Default Re: New project for the benefit of all classic computing!

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Originally Posted by Thorham View Post
New ones. Amiga keyboards suck.
Yes they do, except for the ones with Cherry Black switches.


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Membrane and rubber dome keyboards are a load of crap
True dat.

Quote:
Topre is expensive, and Cherry MX switches are fine.
True dat 2. But there are so many Cherry switches. Hard to pick just one

Quote:
Nothing wrong with Cherry.
My fingers are 1000x more sensitive than yours. I want to try both Cherry and Topre. Neither are perfect. The perfect keyboard switch has yet to be mass-produced. It is just that both Cherry and Topre are 128x better than membrane high-impact antiergonomical evil diabolical treacherous devious smash-ur-finger-into-an-immoveable-object-on-every-keypress keyboards.
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Old 11-12-2012, 05:09 AM   #45
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Default Re: New project for the benefit of all classic computing!

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Originally Posted by Lord Aga View Post
That's fine with me, but they must have Amiga keys layout. No PC keyboards with stickers and adapters. If it's gonna be done, it has to be done right
You can simply buy keycaps with the Amiga "A" printed on instead of that abominable M$ logo. But u hafta buy 1000+ at a time.

Or you can just buy blank keycaps without having to do anything special. And you can buy as many as u want. If the Amiga keys are blank, everyone will know what they are. Or u could put a sticker on it if a blank key bothers u.
There are many solutions.
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Old 11-12-2012, 05:20 AM   #46
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Default Re: New project for the benefit of all classic computing!

Well, it's not the windows/blank/sticker-ed keys that bother me the most. It's the layout. Del & Help VS 9 PC keys, too many Fs, etc.
Your solution is certainly easier, so... more power to you But if possible, I would like a proper Amiga keyboard some day.
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Old 11-12-2012, 05:22 AM   #47
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Default Re: New project for the benefit of all classic computing!

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Originally Posted by ChaosLord View Post
What you are saying is completely true.

I am just not convinced that the potential bug you describe is anything more than an extremely rare phenomenon.

Millions of people have 32-bit computers and I have never heard of any of them having problems when they added the 3rd GB of ram.

Have you ever had a 32-bit computer start malfunctioning when adding the 3rd GB of RAM?
It's not a bug specific to 32-bit systems per se, it's a bug resulting from the inconsistent interpretation of 32-bit address values (when performing arithmetic on them )within different parts of AmigaOS and software that runs on it. Other operating systems may not be affected.
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Old 11-12-2012, 05:32 AM   #48
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Default Re: New project for the benefit of all classic computing!

@LordAGA
I don't care about the specific layout too terribly much. But I do require a Scroll Lock key because my KVM switch uses it to switch between my Amiga and bgcpc.

Since thousands of ppl use KVM switches to link 1 Amiga + 1 pc to 1 single monitor the keyboard needs all standard pc keys.... so u see, its just easier to make a keyboard in a more-or-less standard pc layout because other KVM switches may use other strange pc keys.

But the main thing is that the keys should have springs in them so that they don't cause Nerve Damage, RSI, Tendonitis, Carpal Tunnel Syndrome, RSD, CRPS, etc.
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Old 11-12-2012, 05:36 AM   #49
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Default Re: New project for the benefit of all classic computing!

Talking mechanical switches eh

Well I would LOVE a replacement keyboard with Cherry BLUE switches for my A1200 Yepp you heard right BLUE clicking switches is my thing.

Well I would be happy enough with a empty board and ill fit what ever switches I want myself.

But something a lot of people would like is replacement keys to replace their yellowed ones!
Would rock if we could get our hands on replacement keys and a big bonus would be to get new keys without crappy pad printing, I would love to see keys with a good dye method like dye sub or double shot or atleast laser etching would be nice to have

If some people pitch in we could get replacement keys by filling a big enough order, I would pitch in for this to happen
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Old 11-12-2012, 05:46 AM   #50
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Default Re: New project for the benefit of all classic computing!

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Talking mechanical switches eh

Well I would LOVE a replacement keyboard with Cherry BLUE switches for my A1200 Yepp you heard right BLUE clicking switches is my thing.
I love all cherry switches. I just love some more than others

Quote:
Well I would be happy enough with a empty board and ill fit what ever switches I want myself.
Does any such a board exist???

Don't you hafta solder the switches on?

It would be nice to have Snap-On Cherry switches. That would just totally rawkout!


Quote:
But something a lot of people would like is replacement keys to replace their yellowed ones!
Would rock if we could get our hands on replacement keys and a big bonus would be to get new keys without crappy pad printing, I would love to see keys with a good dye method like dye sub or double shot or atleast laser etching would be nice to have
I think we can just give up on doubleshot right off the bat.
I would be totally happy with Dye-Sublimation printing. The quality is fantastic! Laser-etching is cheaper and great for you but not so great for me. I really need smoooooooth keycaps.

We could get cheap-O pad printed Amiga keys and then give the user 2 extra keys with their keyboard so they can replace their Amiga keys every few years.
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Old 11-12-2012, 05:53 AM   #51
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Default Re: New project for the benefit of all classic computing!

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Originally Posted by ChaosLord View Post
I love all cherry switches. I just love some more than others
Me 2, I like all cherry switches and blue are my favorite

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Originally Posted by ChaosLord View Post
Does any such a board exist???
Don't you hafta solder the switches on?
It would be nice to have Snap-On Cherry switches. That would just totally rawkout!
No it do not exist yet, but I would love to have it made


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Originally Posted by ChaosLord View Post
I think we can just give up on doubleshot right off the bat.
I would be totally happy with Dye-Sublimation printing. The quality is fantastic! Laser-etching is cheaper and great for you but not so great for me. I really need smoooooooth keycaps.

We could get cheap-O pad printed Amiga keys and then give the user 2 extra keys with their keyboard so they can replace their Amiga keys every few years.
Yeah, I would be happy with any replacement keys, but I can always dream
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Old 11-12-2012, 05:55 AM   #52
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Default Re: New project for the benefit of all classic computing!

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If some people pitch in we could get replacement keys by filling a big enough order, I would pitch in for this to happen
I don't know how that would work.

Every Amiga keyboard uses a different type of switch and a different type of keycap.

Are you saying you want replacement keycaps for a desktop A1200?

1. Why, man? Get urself a detached keyboard.

2. There are loads of broken A1200s that u can take the keys off of, right?
I have a broken A1200 sitting in my closet. The keyboard controller is broken so its completely useless. But there is nothing wrong with the keys themselves. I also have 2 broken A3000 keyboards. I used to have 3 or broken A500s with perfectly working keyboards stashed at my Dad's house but my evil stepmom threw them away. All those beautiful Amiga Keycaps gone
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Old 11-12-2012, 06:11 AM   #53
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Default Re: New project for the benefit of all classic computing!

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Originally Posted by ChaosLord View Post
I don't know how that would work.

Every Amiga keyboard uses a different type of switch and a different type of keycap.
Yes, we need loads of people pitching for the Amiga replacement keys they want ^^
WOuld require quite the amount of cash tho

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Are you saying you want replacement keycaps for a desktop A1200?

1. Why, man? Get urself a detached keyboard.
I love to have the wedge keyboard intact on my A1200, now I was lucky enough to get my hands on a NOS keyboard recently, but as me we are many Amiga users world wide that want other keyboard layouts then US/UK etc, the NOS keyboard I got has Norwegian layout but it is nearly identical to the Swedish one.
But I am thinking of getting a extra QPAD keyboard with blue switches, I guess ill get the one I have now, it's a PS/2 keyboard and no limits on simultaneous keypresses

But the layout is important to many people and depending on what layout you use it can be a pain to get your hands on replacements.

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2. There are loads of broken A1200s that u can take the keys off of, right?
I have a broken A1200 sitting in my closet. The keyboard controller is broken so its completely useless. But there is nothing wrong with the keys themselves. I also have 2 broken A3000 keyboards. I used to have 3 or broken A500s with perfectly working keyboards stashed at my Dad's house but my evil stepmom threw them away. All those beautiful Amiga Keycaps gone
Yepp but you do not have my keyboard layout and where I live it's rare to find replacements
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Old 11-12-2012, 07:32 AM   #54
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Default Re: New project for the benefit of all classic computing!

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Yepp but you do not have my keyboard layout and where I live it's rare to find replacements
Do you type a lot of texts in the Secret Proprietary Encrypted Language of the Kingdom of Swedonia?

I ask because all Swedonians seem to be expert English writers and any Amiga keyboard can type any weird (and kewl) Swedish chars. Its just a matter of how easy or hard it is.

A US Amiga keyboard using US Layout and US Keyboard driver can type all Swedish chars but it requires typing "special key combos". Of course u probably already knew this
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Old 11-12-2012, 07:43 AM   #55
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Default Re: New project for the benefit of all classic computing!

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Originally Posted by Karlos View Post
It's not a bug specific to 32-bit systems per se, it's a bug resulting from the inconsistent interpretation of 32-bit address values (when performing arithmetic on them )within different parts of AmigaOS and software that runs on it. Other operating systems may not be affected.
It's the same kind of bull as those ridiculous BCPL pointers. This kind of stuff makes no sense at all. People who write software like that should not even look at computers.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChaosLord View Post
I don't care about the specific layout too terribly much.
PC layout is the best. One of these days I'm just going to get a PS2 mechanical for my Amiga and be done with it. Windows keys or not.
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Old 11-12-2012, 08:51 AM   #56
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Default Re: New project for the benefit of all classic computing!

Here is my wish list for the Commodore Plus/4 & C16:

* blank cartridges for the projects like this: http://inchocks.co.uk/commodore/Diag...al/Diag264.htm
* cartridge cases
* 64k memory expansions. People would love to buy Jurek's 64k expansions, but they are not available anymore. Great product. I was lucky to get one before they were sold out. The Commodore16.com shop was the only place selling them: http://www.commodore16.com/index.php...site-shop.html
* keyboard cables for the Plus/4
* keyboard caps for the Plus/4
* a replacement CPU for the Plus/4 & C16 based on an FPGA
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Old 11-12-2012, 09:12 AM   #57
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Default Re: New project for the benefit of all classic computing!

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Actually, what would be great and practical would be full speed PCI slots for GFX card, SATA, ethernet and USB. A new motherboard fitting a common tower standard with empty 68060 CPU slot, fpga for the custom chips (MiniMig code is available), PCI 5-7 full speed slots, ATX power supply connector, 2-3 1MB MAPROM flash slots (AROS kickstart needs 1MB kickstart) and 1-2 GB of ram. It should be priced $500-$1000 U.S for the motherboard.
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Old 11-12-2012, 09:12 AM   #58
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Default Re: New project for the benefit of all classic computing!

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Originally Posted by ChaosLord View Post
Do you type a lot of texts in the Secret Proprietary Encrypted Language of the Kingdom of Swedonia?

I ask because all Swedonians seem to be expert English writers and any Amiga keyboard can type any weird (and kewl) Swedish chars. Its just a matter of how easy or hard it is.

A US Amiga keyboard using US Layout and US Keyboard driver can type all Swedish chars but it requires typing "special key combos". Of course u probably already knew this
I don't care about the last letters in the Swedish alphabet (I never use them on the Amiga since I only write in English on it anyways) or the different locations of special characters since I know the locations by heart.
But since I live in Sweden and my Amiga is sold and bought in Sweden I like to have Swedish layout on the keyboard.

Also there is quite a lot of difference between US and Swedish layout so I set my Miggys up with swedish layout no matter what the keyboard shows and when using some characters that I do not use to often it can become quite annoying pressing buttons untill you find them.

English layout:

Swedish layout:


The left/right angled bracket, colon/semi colon and the question mark is the most annoying part, the rest is fairly quick to get used to.
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Old 11-12-2012, 09:19 AM   #59
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Default Re: New project for the benefit of all classic computing!

1) An RTG solution for the A1200. maybe a small pcb that fits between the mobo and the accelerator board.
2) A cheap USB solution for the clockport.
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Old 11-12-2012, 09:33 AM   #60
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Default Re: New project for the benefit of all classic computing!

@som99

11 of your keys have 3 symbols on them!!!!

WTF?!?! Why don't US keyboards get 11 keys with 3 symbols on them?!? Or how about 20 keys with 3 symbols on them? That is much much more useful! That way you can actually type out kewl symbols without having to memorize complicated key combos!!! I feel so cheated now.

p.s. u have no Amiga keys in your layout diagram. I can't live without my Amiga keys.
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