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Old 05-25-2011, 04:44 AM   #21
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Default Re: Quake

Quote:
Originally Posted by rvo_nl View Post
Are you sure this is right? I can hardly run the game at playable speed in that resolution yet Im using the PPC/Warp3D version.

From memory I had quake running on PPC with bvison at like 1024 x678 , cant remeber the fps but was very playable.
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Old 05-25-2011, 04:53 AM   #22
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Default Re: Quake

Quote:
Originally Posted by Karlos View Post
Wait, what? You are running a 68060, software-rendered version of quake, in 15-bit at 800x600 ?

Are you sure?

Must be running in Warp3D, not possible to render at that resolution at over 1fps in software! (unless via Winuae! in JIT)

Warp3D version will give 7-10fps at this res with 50mhz 060 which is very playable. Runs very nice indeed on my 72mhz 060
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Old 05-25-2011, 05:01 AM   #23
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Default Re: Quake

Quote:
Originally Posted by utri007 View Post
Runequest: It is because Zorro vs. AGA bus speed. 4,2 vs. 5

With Mediator it si possible to get quite much higher FSP with quake I belive?

Try to find Clickboom Quake060.exe it is 2 fps faster than original exe
4.2MB/s on ZorroII is quite an optimistic value, 3.5MB/s is probably more accurate :-) On AGA in optimal conditions you can transfer data to chipmem at 7MB/s. On OCS machines it's probably around 3.5MB/s with a good cpu accelerator.

I guess that games like Quake would benefit quite a lot killing the OS and writting to chipmem when there's no display and also crunching numbers while the c2p is being done.
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Old 05-25-2011, 06:05 AM   #24
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Default Re: Quake

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Originally Posted by pan1k View Post
Yeah, no I wasn't! LOL. It was 15 bit 320x200. Best I got was 14 FPS.
I was about to say, someone must have gone in and optimised the hell out of it since I last looked, then. In reality 800x600 at 15-bit would need 937.5KiB per frame to be transferred over the bus. So, even with an infinitely fast CPU (where rendering and game logic takes no time at all), the best you could get out of for example the BVision would be about ~15fps. A mediator 1200 based graphics card would probably max out at about 8-9fps under the same conditions.
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Old 05-25-2011, 06:24 AM   #25
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Default Re: Quake

Im probably getting confussed with running glquake on an old pc or something
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Old 05-25-2011, 08:54 AM   #26
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Default Re: Quake

I did find a patch on Aminet and used it. It gave me an extra 2 or 3 fps. I played around with the different screen modes, and for me, the 200X320 8bit Cybervision was slower (but not by much) to the 200X300 AGA mode. Maybe I was thinking of when I had a PPC card.. *shrug*
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Old 05-25-2011, 09:18 AM   #27
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Default Re: Quake

I think it's best to realize that given bus speed limitations and CPU clock issues that an Amiga with 68k (even a souped up one) can't push textured polys around at any acceptable resolution.

Now with that said, yeah, you can get some screaming speeds out of UAE+Quake, or Doom on 68k based systems.

But Quake is after the Amiga's time, and "getting it to play" at tiny, tiny screensizes and tiny resolutions is an iffy prospect at best, assuming you want consistent FPS in double digits.
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Old 05-25-2011, 10:39 AM   #28
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Default Re: Quake

Can someone explain to me the different rendering options under quake? There was c2p, double and even triple modes. Normal 3.1 routines and 040-060 routines depending on what screenmode was in use.
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Old 05-25-2011, 11:27 AM   #29
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Default Re: Quake

From ClickBOOM FAQ:

So, is there anything I can do to improve speed other than to buy better hardware?
Sure there is. You can use some or all of the options listed below (not in any particular order):
- Reduce the size of displaying area by using "-" key.
- Use odd , oddx2 , 1x2 or 2x2 screen modes.
- Choose a different "blur distance" value.
- Choose a different "detail" value.
- If you are playing it on AGA, don't use slow Multiscan, DBLNTS or DBLPAL modes.
- Choose not to display your weapon.
- Turn sound off.
- Play with a mouse.
- Choose "always run" option.
- If you have 060 be a real man and overclock it to 66MHz!
- Stick to 8-bit mode. 16-bit looks better but is slower.
- If you have an 060 board in your A4000 put memory simms on it rather than the motherboard.
- Disable water warping.

I didn't see a higher FPS rate with my Cybervision. Weird huh? Maybe if I got a faster 060 it would help. MIne is 50MHZ.
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Last edited by pan1k; 05-25-2011 at 11:29 AM..
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Old 05-25-2011, 11:54 AM   #30
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Default Re: Quake

in my experience in 3d shooter' games ....AGA is always faster than any gfx card...even compared with the fastest zorro 3 cards like the picasso 4 or the cybervision 64 /3d
AGA in PAL mode or NTSC beats any gfx card
the few exceptions are of course if the game uses warp3d libraries where the 3d engine of the gfx card do all the work....for example GL quake
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Old 05-25-2011, 03:23 PM   #31
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Default Re: Quake

Surgeon made quite a few optimisations.
http://surgeon.users2.50megs.com/qua...es/Qboost4.txt

"Recomended config for DM (68060/66):
NTSC, viewsize 80, fov 100, pixelmode 2, d_mipcap 3, snd_frequency 5513
Remember to use the parameter -particles 1, when starting Quake!

This config gives me 21.80 FPS with timedemo demo2."
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Old 05-25-2011, 04:34 PM   #32
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Default Re: Quake

Quote:
Originally Posted by LaserBack View Post
in my experience in 3d shooter' games ....AGA is always faster than any gfx card...even compared with the fastest zorro 3 cards like the picasso 4 or the cybervision 64 /3d
AGA in PAL mode or NTSC beats any gfx card
the few exceptions are of course if the game uses warp3d libraries where the 3d engine of the gfx card do all the work....for example GL quake
That's what I've seen. The best performance I got was with PPC quake running with AGA screen. This was way before any AOS4 stuff. There was some illegal port or something I got hold of and that thing worked great, back in the day.

Kinda sad, that we can't get it to work better on an 8 Meg graphics card like B-Vision...
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Old 05-25-2011, 05:31 PM   #33
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Default Re: Quake

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Originally Posted by TheGoose View Post
That's what I've seen. The best performance I got was with PPC quake running with AGA screen. This was way before any AOS4 stuff. There was some illegal port or something I got hold of and that thing worked great, back in the day.

Kinda sad, that we can't get it to work better on an 8 Meg graphics card like B-Vision...
You can, you just need to leverage the card's 3D features rather than doing it in software.
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Old 05-25-2011, 08:39 PM   #34
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Default Re: Quake

Quote:
Originally Posted by Karlos View Post
You can, you just need to leverage the card's 3D features rather than doing it in software.
Yep. I get ~16 fps with GLQuake/BlitzQuake "timedemo demo1" the 2nd time (textures cached) at 640x400x16 with CSMK3 68060@75MHz, Mediator with Voodoo4 and tweaked Warp3D drivers. The 68060 can push descent frame rates even with a slow Mediator bus but the 68k Warp3D drivers are very poorly optimized. No, the 3D card does NOT do all the work! GLQuake/BlitzQuake is fairly well optimized, especially considering it's mostly C and uses the FPU.
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Old 05-25-2011, 09:06 PM   #35
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Default Re: Quake

Interesting thread. I tried messing around with the console as suggested by lionstorm. All of that made quake look really bad. So I guess just run the AGA mode in 300x200.
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Old 05-26-2011, 02:26 AM   #36
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Default Re: Quake

I did some testing of all Quake ports on my heavily optimised 603e/240mhz+060+bvision. Here are my results:

1) BlitzQuake (68k+Warp3D)
320x200 18.6fps (ppc version doesnt work)

2) GLQuakeWOS (WarpOS+Warp3D)
320x240 29.3fps (31.6 with r_fullbright set)
800x600 6.5fps

3) QuakePPC (PPC+CGX)
320x240 24fps
800x600 6.5fps

4) WarpQuake (WarpOS+CGX)
320x200 24fps
800x600 5.4fps

5) AwinQuake (PPC+CGX)
320x240 20fps

6) 'Clickboom' Quake (68K+CGX)
320x200 11fps

7) Coolquake (68K+CGX)
320x240 ..fps (still have to find this one. help?)
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Old 05-26-2011, 07:03 AM   #37
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Default Re: Quake

Quote:
Originally Posted by rvo_nl View Post
I did some testing of all Quake ports on my heavily optimised 603e/240mhz+060+bvision. Here are my results:

1) BlitzQuake (68k+Warp3D)
320x200 18.6fps (ppc version doesnt work)

2) GLQuakeWOS (WarpOS+Warp3D)
320x240 29.3fps (31.6 with r_fullbright set)
800x600 6.5fps

3) QuakePPC (PPC+CGX)
320x240 24fps
800x600 6.5fps

4) WarpQuake (WarpOS+CGX)
320x200 24fps
800x600 5.4fps

5) AwinQuake (PPC+CGX)
320x240 20fps

6) 'Clickboom' Quake (68K+CGX)
320x200 11fps

7) Coolquake (68K+CGX)
320x240 ..fps (still have to find this one. help?)
Pitiful.

With PPC Quake, in the GUI, I could see no screen options for 640x480, was using CGX.
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Old 05-26-2011, 07:12 AM   #38
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Default Re: Quake

@LaserBack

Quote:
AGA is always faster than any gfx card...even compared with the fastest zorro 3 cards like the picasso 4 or the cybervision 64 /3d
AGA in PAL mode or NTSC beats any gfx card
with A1200 perhaps but not with A4000. Real ZorroIII cards like CV64 (not the 3D model)+Buster11 give a pair of frames more in games like Doom (using EDoom instead of ADoom for example)
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Old 05-26-2011, 07:33 AM   #39
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Default Re: Quake

Tell us your quake fps with that system? I belive that Picasso 4 is one of the best cards made for amiga. It is proven that it doesn't give any performance increase compared to zorro 2 vs. zorro 3
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Old 05-26-2011, 08:30 AM   #40
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Default Re: Quake

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheGoose View Post
Pitiful.
With PPC Quake, in the GUI, I could see no screen options for 640x480, was using CGX.
So you can get a higher framerate using AGA? Please let me know how much!

Its easy to config PPC Quake, its all in the docs.
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