amiga.org
     
iconAll times are GMT -6. The time now is 08:05 AM. | Welcome to Forum, please register to access all of our features.

» Amiga.org » Amiga computer related discussion » Amiga Hardware Issues and discussion » Amiga hardware superiority

Amiga Hardware Issues and discussion This forum is dedicated to the discussion and resolution of issues related to Classic and Next Generation Amiga hardware. Got a problem with a piece of hardware? Click to speak.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 12-01-2010, 07:53 AM   #1
Gulliver
Defender of the Faith
Points: 15,274, Level: 79 Points: 15,274, Level: 79 Points: 15,274, Level: 79
Activity: 5% Activity: 5% Activity: 5%
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: South of the south
Posts: 1,365
Blog Entries: 2
Default Amiga hardware superiority

I was comparing the Amiga with its competitors back in those times in the hardware aspect.

Each machine is listed with its default factory configuration (third party expansions are not taken into account).




Do you think the Amiga was superior in all aspects?

Last edited by Gulliver; 12-01-2010 at 07:57 AM..
Gulliver is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-01-2010, 07:54 AM   #2
Franko
Banned
Points: 22,799, Level: 93 Points: 22,799, Level: 93 Points: 22,799, Level: 93
Activity: 8% Activity: 8% Activity: 8%
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 5,707
Blog Entries: 33
Default Re: Amiga hardware superiority

Of course...
Franko is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-01-2010, 08:02 AM   #3
Gulliver
Defender of the Faith
Points: 15,274, Level: 79 Points: 15,274, Level: 79 Points: 15,274, Level: 79
Activity: 5% Activity: 5% Activity: 5%
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: South of the south
Posts: 1,365
Blog Entries: 2
Default Re: Amiga hardware superiority

Well, I woul have chosen for the cpu & bus speed of the Quadra, and the audio from the Falcon.
Gulliver is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-01-2010, 08:07 AM   #4
tone007
sad moaning faced git
Points: 15,136, Level: 79 Points: 15,136, Level: 79 Points: 15,136, Level: 79
Activity: 2% Activity: 2% Activity: 2%
 
tone007's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Virginia, USA
Posts: 3,212
Send a message via AIM to tone007
Default Re: Amiga hardware superiority

Going by that chart, I'd have to say the Mac is the clear winner.
__________________
3 Commodore file cabinets, 2 Commodore USB turntables, 1 AmigaWorld beer mug
Alienware M14x i7 laptop running AmigaForever
tone007 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-01-2010, 08:09 AM   #5
fishy_fiz
Defender of the Faith
Points: 14,692, Level: 78 Points: 14,692, Level: 78 Points: 14,692, Level: 78
Activity: 8% Activity: 8% Activity: 8%
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 1,635
Blog Entries: 1
Default Re: Amiga hardware superiority

Those specs are a little innacurate. 1024x768+overscan on aga ? X68030 also had 16 bit color (65536 colors) onscreen. Im sure there's other errors there too, but it's too late and Im not interested enough to find them As much as Id like to say otherwise, there are some areas that the amiga was completely humbled in vs. some of the other machines of the day.
Not that I care too much,... I love the amiga regardless.
fishy_fiz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-01-2010, 08:11 AM   #6
countzero
Defender of the Faith
Points: 10,900, Level: 69 Points: 10,900, Level: 69 Points: 10,900, Level: 69
Activity: 4% Activity: 4% Activity: 4%
 
countzero's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Tokyo
Posts: 1,937
Blog Entries: 1
Default Re: Amiga hardware superiority

hmm, you've just proven that apples are superior to oranges and bananas. you should stand proud
__________________
I believe in mt. Fuji
countzero is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-01-2010, 08:19 AM   #7
Gulliver
Defender of the Faith
Points: 15,274, Level: 79 Points: 15,274, Level: 79 Points: 15,274, Level: 79
Activity: 5% Activity: 5% Activity: 5%
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: South of the south
Posts: 1,365
Blog Entries: 2
Default Re: Amiga hardware superiority

Yes probably I made a mistake or two on the chart, but despite those Mac lovers, I still think it was not the best machine.
Gulliver is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-01-2010, 08:25 AM   #8
Heiroglyph
Cult Member
Points: 8,620, Level: 62 Points: 8,620, Level: 62 Points: 8,620, Level: 62
Activity: 11% Activity: 11% Activity: 11%
 
Heiroglyph's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 846
Default Re: Amiga hardware superiority

The 4000T is nice, but the technology was already long in the tooth.

Also, calling Paula a DSP is pushing it and they didn't come with a CDRom.

To be fair, most only shipped with an 880k capable drive.
Heiroglyph is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-01-2010, 08:30 AM   #9
tone007
sad moaning faced git
Points: 15,136, Level: 79 Points: 15,136, Level: 79 Points: 15,136, Level: 79
Activity: 2% Activity: 2% Activity: 2%
 
tone007's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Virginia, USA
Posts: 3,212
Send a message via AIM to tone007
Default Re: Amiga hardware superiority

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gulliver View Post
Yes probably I made a mistake or two on the chart, but despite those Mac lovers, I still think it was not the best machine.
I'm no Mac lover, but if you're talking hardware specification superiority, it's clear the 4000T is not the winner.
__________________
3 Commodore file cabinets, 2 Commodore USB turntables, 1 AmigaWorld beer mug
Alienware M14x i7 laptop running AmigaForever
tone007 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-01-2010, 08:31 AM   #10
Karlos
Sockologist
Points: 50,618, Level: 100 Points: 50,618, Level: 100 Points: 50,618, Level: 100
Activity: 5% Activity: 5% Activity: 5%
 
Karlos's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Barishabaad, Sardistan
Posts: 16,667
Blog Entries: 18
Default Re: Amiga hardware superiority

The A4000 was towards the very end of the Commodore era when it was clear the company was sinking fast.

If you look earlier than that, it's pretty clear that the A1000 owned anything the competitors had at the time.

Other than the obvious A4000T, the only other machines in that list that interest me are the Falcon and X68030. The NeXT box would be kind of interesting but a bit meh.
__________________
OCA
This isn't SCSI... This is SATA!!!
I have CDO. It's like OCD except all the letters are in ascending order. The way they should be.
Core2 Quad Q9450 2.66GHz / X48T / 4GB DDR3 / nVidia GTX275 / Linux x64, AROS, Win64
A1XE 800MHz / 512MB / Radeon 9200 / OS4.1
A1200T BPPC 240MHz / 256MB / Permedia 2 / OS 3.1 - OS3.9, OS4
A1200T Apollo 1240 28MHz / 32MB / Mediator1200 / Voodoo 3000 / OS3.9
A1200D Apollo 1240 25MHz (ejector seat ROM edition) / 32MB
Karlos is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-01-2010, 08:33 AM   #11
Franko
Banned
Points: 22,799, Level: 93 Points: 22,799, Level: 93 Points: 22,799, Level: 93
Activity: 8% Activity: 8% Activity: 8%
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 5,707
Blog Entries: 33
Default Re: Amiga hardware superiority

I still say OF COURSE, but then I'm totally biased, ignorant, thick and proud of it...
Franko is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-01-2010, 08:38 AM   #12
Gulliver
Defender of the Faith
Points: 15,274, Level: 79 Points: 15,274, Level: 79 Points: 15,274, Level: 79
Activity: 5% Activity: 5% Activity: 5%
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: South of the south
Posts: 1,365
Blog Entries: 2
Default Re: Amiga hardware superiority

@Heiroglyph
My brother´s A4000T when bought new came with the 1.76MB floppy and I believe it was a 2x cdrom reader.
Paula is more likely a poor man´s DSP I didnt know where to put it.

@Tone007
I believe, there isnt a total winner or looser. It is that some aspects of some of the contenders were really good and others not so much.

@Karlos
I agree that back in the days of the A1000, it was the computer to have, every IT/geek guy was having wet dreams with it.
I wish I could have one of each, less the Next, which I dont find especially interesting.

Last edited by Gulliver; 12-01-2010 at 08:43 AM..
Gulliver is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-01-2010, 08:41 AM   #13
bloodline
Master Sock Abuser
Points: 39,766, Level: 100 Points: 39,766, Level: 100 Points: 39,766, Level: 100
Activity: 25% Activity: 25% Activity: 25%
 
bloodline's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: London, UK
Posts: 11,973
Blog Entries: 3
Default Re: Amiga hardware superiority

Quote:
Originally Posted by Karlos View Post
The A4000 was towards the very end of the Commodore era when it was clear the company was sinking fast.

If you look earlier than that, it's pretty clear that the A1000 owned anything the competitors had at the time.

Other than the obvious A4000T, the only other machines in that list that interest me are the Falcon and X68030. The NeXT box would be kind of interesting but a bit meh.
I've got a NeXT box right here... But for some weird reason it has a picture of a half eaten fruit on it :-?
__________________
My iPhone Game: Puny Humans -
http://itunes.apple.com/gb/app/puny-...362230281?mt=8
bloodline is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-01-2010, 08:45 AM   #14
Franko
Banned
Points: 22,799, Level: 93 Points: 22,799, Level: 93 Points: 22,799, Level: 93
Activity: 8% Activity: 8% Activity: 8%
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 5,707
Blog Entries: 33
Default Re: Amiga hardware superiority

At the end of the day it's not really about which machine had the better hardware specs, it's really about what the all those clever coders & programmers wrote for it, that made each machine what it was...
Franko is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-01-2010, 08:47 AM   #15
bloodline
Master Sock Abuser
Points: 39,766, Level: 100 Points: 39,766, Level: 100 Points: 39,766, Level: 100
Activity: 25% Activity: 25% Activity: 25%
 
bloodline's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: London, UK
Posts: 11,973
Blog Entries: 3
Default Re: Amiga hardware superiority

Quote:
Originally Posted by Franko View Post
At the end of the day it's not really about which machine had the better hardware specs, it's really about what the all those clever coders & programmers wrote for it, that made each machine what it was...
Hmmm, no... I think what is boils down to, is which one did you get for christmas when you were ten
__________________
My iPhone Game: Puny Humans -
http://itunes.apple.com/gb/app/puny-...362230281?mt=8
bloodline is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-01-2010, 08:51 AM   #16
Hattig
Cult Member
Points: 10,739, Level: 68 Points: 10,739, Level: 68 Points: 10,739, Level: 68
Activity: 5% Activity: 5% Activity: 5%
 
Hattig's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 851
Send a message via AIM to Hattig
Default Re: Amiga hardware superiority

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gulliver View Post
Yes probably I made a mistake or two on the chart, but despite those Mac lovers, I still think it was not the best machine.
Well the Mac had Mac OS ... and a fixed frame buffer style of graphics. Shapeshifter ran Mac OS quicker on an Amiga than a Mac with the same CPU IIRC.
Hattig is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-01-2010, 08:52 AM   #17
Franko
Banned
Points: 22,799, Level: 93 Points: 22,799, Level: 93 Points: 22,799, Level: 93
Activity: 8% Activity: 8% Activity: 8%
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 5,707
Blog Entries: 33
Default Re: Amiga hardware superiority

Quote:
Originally Posted by bloodline View Post
Hmmm, no... I think what is boils down to, is which one did you get for christmas when you were ten
They didn't have home computers when I was 10...

(at 10 I got my first electronic keyboard an old Bontempi (i think) reed organ, the ruddy fan was louder than the music... )
Franko is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-01-2010, 09:05 AM   #18
orb85750
Defender of the Faith
Points: 16,766, Level: 82 Points: 16,766, Level: 82 Points: 16,766, Level: 82
Activity: 8% Activity: 8% Activity: 8%
 
orb85750's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: USA
Posts: 1,218
Default Re: Amiga hardware superiority

I don't have time to do it, but it would be nice to see such a chart for 1990 too.
orb85750 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-01-2010, 09:12 AM   #19
mechy
Cult Member
Points: 13,011, Level: 74 Points: 13,011, Level: 74 Points: 13,011, Level: 74
Activity: 13% Activity: 13% Activity: 13%
 
mechy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Texas,usa
Posts: 933
Send a message via AIM to mechy Send a message via MSN to mechy
Default Re: Amiga hardware superiority

Yes,as pointed out,most quikpak and amiga technologies 4000t's had 880K drives, but some true C= a4000t's had the HD floppy from the factory.None came with cdroms as standard.

Not sure when the quikpak 060 A4000T model came out,probabaly a good bit after 1994~ would of looked better in the chart in any case.

I Love the 4000t also but the mac is the clear winner with 128MB capable on board,16bit sound,and 24bit (16mil colors) gfx.I never could understand why most mac's used LC 68040's tho..

Of course you could go crazy expanding the 4000t and make it a nice machine.

I would be scared to see ther prices on these originally.
mechy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-01-2010, 09:18 AM   #20
Pentad
Technoid
Points: 10,851, Level: 69 Points: 10,851, Level: 69 Points: 10,851, Level: 69
Activity: 11% Activity: 11% Activity: 11%
 
Pentad's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Posts: 286
Default Re: Amiga hardware superiority

I think this chart really goes to show had badly the Amiga hardware was becoming by 1994. Honest, I'm not trying to start a flame war but I'm just being realistic. I really have fond memories of the Amiga and of Commodore but it just wasn't competitive by the mid 90s. Some thoughts:

-AGA was just not good enough. It was late to the party and only extended OCS/ECS for a short time.

-Do you realize that Paula was roughly 10 years old by 1994!?

-8 Bit audio was an embarrassment compared to the plethora of sound cards of the PC world and the Mac's built-in audio.

-3DFX was testing their Voodoo 1 3D cards in 1994 for the PC. I remember seeing a demo of it on DOS/Windows 95 Beta at CES in Chicago in the summer of 94. AGA seemed quaint and backwards compared to 3DFX.

-Windows 95 would be released in August of 1994 and would kill Commodore and Atari and nearly kill Apple a few years later

-Apple's hardware was still stuck with System 7.x but the hardware was getting better and better

In the end, I think you can see the major problem here for Commodore and Amiga: Technology Product Cycle. The Amiga started theirs in 1985 and it was cutting edge but it was coming to an end in 1994/1995. Apple/Microsoft/PC were just starting theirs at this time but the big deal is that it gave them something to grow into. Apple was moving to PPC, Windows would get better and better (NT 4 was an amazing OS) and this would lead to Windows 2k/XP, and finally the PC world got PCI in '92 and folks like 3DFX were going to bring 3D acceleration to the masses.

What did Commodore have? AmigaOS was very mature but had no place to go. It was so tied to the hardware that any small change would kill legacy apps. Look what a mess it was going from 1.3 to 2.x/3.x.

AAA (or whatever) should have been started in 1988 and pushed hard by R&D so that as one TPC ended (started in 1985) Commodore could have transitioned to a a new TPC for the 90s.

AmigaOS 4 should have been developed along with AAA and included modern features like memory protection. By the late 80's, everybody in the computer world recognized that memory protection is a must for a stable, modern OS.

Microsoft developed NT (based on ideas from VAX) with memory protection (among many other things) because its where you had to go. Consumer Windows was always planned to intersect Windows NT and they did a great job of slowly getting everybody there.

Apple and Commodore had the same problem with their OS. You can't just 'bolt on' modern features and a rewrite kills your current apps that keep you in business. Apple's soap opera like quest for a new OS was certainly amazing and they just got lucky with Steve Jobs and NeXT.

Commodore was...well, Commodore. What worked in the 1980s for them failed in the 1990s...and here we are.

Cheers!
-P
__________________
2013 15" Macbook Pro Retina * 2.6 GHz QCore * 16 GB RAM, 1TB SSD * Windows 7 Ultimate 64bit via Boot Camp * 3rd Gen 32 GB iPod Touch *Amiga via Emulation (WinUAE in WINE)
Pentad is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Tags
superiority , hardware , amiga

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump