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Author Topic: Amiga 3000, Deneb and the different Busters  (Read 8477 times)

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Offline save2600Topic starter

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Amiga 3000, Deneb and the different Busters
« on: February 10, 2010, 02:55:22 PM »
Okay - in trying to decipher Deneb's manual, am I reading this right?

1) Buster 11 is only capable of ONE active busmaster and that is being used solely for the built in SCSI. No workarounds.

2) Buster 9 allows several simultaneous busmasters, as long as all use a "special" workaround.

...since there's a Buster 11 in my machine and the only way I can get Deneb to work in my A3000 is if I force Zorro II mode, will putting a Buster 9 in the machine allow Deneb to use Zorro III/DMA?

If so and in this case, wouldn't that make the Buster 9 chip superior? A little confusing since one would think a later revision would be the better. In any case, if a Buster 9 is what I need in order to be able to use the Zorro III mode, I'm gonna need one...
« Last Edit: February 10, 2010, 03:32:27 PM by save2600 »
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Offline Matt_H

Re: Amiga 3000, Deneb and the different Busters
« Reply #1 on: February 10, 2010, 04:17:14 PM »
You can run it in Zorro III mode, just not DMA Zorro III mode. Just use denebpio.device with Poseidon.

Incidentally, this is exactly what I'm doing.
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Offline save2600Topic starter

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Re: Amiga 3000, Deneb and the different Busters
« Reply #2 on: February 10, 2010, 04:21:29 PM »
Matt_H: I'll throw my A3000 back together here and investigate further, but the only way I could get this card to work is by setting that jumper to Zorro II mode. I don't remember off hand what .device is being used, but I do remember that I couldn't seem to add another easily.

What's the quick scoop on this and how do I enable that mode you're talking about? There are two other modes, dma.device is one and they're both ghosted and say 'offline'...
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Offline Matt_H

Re: Amiga 3000, Deneb and the different Busters
« Reply #3 on: February 10, 2010, 04:24:42 PM »
Zorro III non-DMA mode = denebpio.device. Delete the others (from Poseidon, that is, not Devs:USBHardware).

You might need a firmware update if even that's not working. My board was a bit wonky until the V9 firmware.
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Offline LoadWB

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Re: Amiga 3000, Deneb and the different Busters
« Reply #4 on: February 11, 2010, 05:03:07 AM »
This thread is relevant to my interests as I obtained a 3000D for Christmas.  I have contemplated replacing my Buster 9 with an 11 (as well as the complement chip, Ramsey, I believe.)  Given my interest in a Deneb for my 4000D and a future one for the 3000D, I give this idea pause.  Would there be any deleterious effects from staying with the Buster 9?
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Offline Tumbleweed

Re: Amiga 3000, Deneb and the different Busters
« Reply #5 on: February 11, 2010, 08:49:00 PM »
@LoadWB

Ive got a Deneb board in my A4000D, Rev 9 Buster. The card only works without hitch by setting the jumper to force ZII on the deneb board. If I remove the jumper (ie allow ZIII) the Deneb is unstable - my USB mouse works ok, but transferring files to and from my flash card reader crashes the system everytime.

If I fit the Deneb in my A3000D the Deneb works fine in PIOMode.

Weed
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Offline save2600Topic starter

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Re: Amiga 3000, Deneb and the different Busters
« Reply #6 on: February 11, 2010, 08:52:00 PM »
Quote from: Tumbleweed;542729
If I fit the Deneb in my A3000D the Deneb works fine in PIOMode.

Weed
I have yet to try this because I'd rather not dilly-dally around and mess something up experimenting this time. Are you guys saying that you can remove the Zorro II jumper IF you use PIO Mode? Is PIO mode faster than forcing Zorro II mode?
« Last Edit: February 11, 2010, 09:03:18 PM by save2600 »
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Offline LoadWB

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Re: Amiga 3000, Deneb and the different Busters
« Reply #7 on: February 11, 2010, 10:56:43 PM »
Quote from: Tumbleweed;542729
Ive got a Deneb board in my A4000D, Rev 9 Buster. The card only works without hitch by setting the jumper to force ZII on the deneb board. If I remove the jumper (ie allow ZIII) the Deneb is unstable - my USB mouse works ok, but transferring files to and from my flash card reader crashes the system everytime.

If I fit the Deneb in my A3000D the Deneb works fine in PIOMode.


Well, that's a little discouraging.  My 4000D has a Rev 11 Buster, so I would think it would be fine.  But the Rev 9 in the 3000D not being stable would suck. I would very much like to run it in DMA mode to realize its full speed.  Eh, we'll see.  Thanks!
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Offline Matt_H

Re: Amiga 3000, Deneb and the different Busters
« Reply #8 on: February 11, 2010, 11:57:54 PM »
Quote from: save2600;542731
I have yet to try this because I'd rather not dilly-dally around and mess something up experimenting this time. Are you guys saying that you can remove the Zorro II jumper IF you use PIO Mode? Is PIO mode faster than forcing Zorro II mode?


Precisely. I see no reason why it wouldn't be faster (just like the non-DMA CV3D and Picasso IV boards are faster on Zorro III), but I can't confirm first hand. Someone here probably can, though.
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Offline Crumb

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Re: Amiga 3000, Deneb and the different Busters
« Reply #9 on: February 12, 2010, 02:01:11 AM »
"Are you guys saying that you can remove the Zorro II jumper IF you use PIO Mode? Is PIO mode faster than forcing Zorro II mode? "

Sure, it should work without problems in ZorroIII PIO mode. Depending on the cards you use perhaps you need to update the firmware (it's easy) but ZorroIII PIO mode is very stable and faster than ZorroII.
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Offline alexh

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Re: Amiga 3000, Deneb and the different Busters
« Reply #10 on: February 12, 2010, 09:36:26 PM »
Quote from: save2600;542413
1) Buster 11 is only capable of ONE active busmaster and that is being used solely for the built in SCSI. No workarounds.
Only A4000T SCSI. A3000 SCSI is not a Zorro III DMA master.

Quote from: save2600;542413
...since there's a Buster 11 in my machine and the only way I can get Deneb to work in my A3000 is if I force Zorro II mode
Should work fine in Zorro III DMA mode assuming you have no other Zorro III DMA masters.
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Offline save2600Topic starter

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Re: Amiga 3000, Deneb and the different Busters
« Reply #11 on: February 12, 2010, 10:21:30 PM »
Hmm, I thought the built-in SCSI was a DMA configuration. Why else does that thing scream? lol  

Yeah, I tried deleting the other devices in Trident and removed the Zorro II jumper on Deneb to no avail. Guess I need to upgrade the firmware, huh? I've updated the software to 4.3 (I think that's it) from 4.0, but that's not the same thing.
« Last Edit: February 12, 2010, 10:24:56 PM by save2600 »
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Offline alexh

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Re: Amiga 3000, Deneb and the different Busters
« Reply #12 on: February 12, 2010, 10:25:56 PM »
The A3000 shipped with a Level 1 Buster 7 which did not contain Zorro III DMA in any shape or form.

The SCSI never changed over the years and so cannot be Zorro III DMA and in turn cannot interfere with DENEB.
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Offline save2600Topic starter

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Re: Amiga 3000, Deneb and the different Busters
« Reply #13 on: February 12, 2010, 10:29:48 PM »
Okay... well, so you're saying that irregardless of which Firmware I have in the machine (there are no other Zorro III cards installed), Deneb should automatically default to Zorro III? In my case, it does not.

IS there a way to ask Deneb which version of Firmware I have installed before I dismantle the machine again?
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Offline Damion

Re: Amiga 3000, Deneb and the different Busters
« Reply #14 on: February 12, 2010, 10:33:51 PM »
Quote from: alexh;542899
The A3000 shipped with a Level 1 Buster 7 which did not contain Zorro III DMA in any shape or form.

The SCSI never changed over the years and so cannot be Zorro III DMA and in turn cannot interfere with DENEB.

Makes perfect sense, there's no SCSI DMA over the Zorro bus (just to onboard RAM) so why would the DENEB be affected?

Wouldn't this also be the case with the A4000T (NCR motherboard SCSI)?
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