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Old 01-04-2006, 07:32 AM   #31
AMIGAZ
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Default Re: Monitors - Commodore or Philips?

Quote:
AmiDude wrote:
@Amigaz wrote:
Quote:
Better get a military spec Nec MS 3D, if you can find one that is.
???
There are no such things...
Sorry, I just quoted or old friend BoingBoss, DoomMaster but I guess you haven't been around here too long to know who he is.
Do a search for his old posts here and you'll know what I mean by mil. spec
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Old 01-04-2006, 07:36 AM   #32
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Default Re: Monitors - Commodore or Philips?

OK, I'll look into that...
:-)
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Old 01-04-2006, 07:36 AM   #33
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Default Re: Monitors - Commodore or Philips?

Quote:
steve30 wrote:
The multisync ones are really hard to find.

So first everyone tells me

'Get a CM8833-II - It's the best and clearest monitor'

So I decide to get the CM8833-II and then everyone tells me

'Don't get a CM8833-II. It's dot pitch is too high so it's not very good.'
The philips is a good monitor for gaming and non high res. work. It's pin sharp for all non interlaced resolutions up tp 640x256(cant remeber how overscan looked). It doesn't have great specs compared with more expensive monitors, but look at it this way. In the pc world today people spend alot of money on high end gpu's that can handle antialiasing with good fps. With a older monitor you get antialiasing for free. :-D
The cm8333II a good monitor and I regret that I sold mine.

If you can find a multiscan monitor that can handle those low horizontal scan rates that many amiga modes use(such almost all games) it will probably be a better buy. Most of them handle resolutions above 640x*** better than the philips(and commodore) monitor. Cant remeber how they handled interlaced modes.

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Old 01-04-2006, 07:39 AM   #34
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Default Re: Monitors - Commodore or Philips?

So as I will be using it on my A500+ for games it will be OK then.
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Old 01-04-2006, 07:41 AM   #35
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Default Re: Monitors - Commodore or Philips?

The Philips lookalikes (C=, Profex, Targa, <some Vobis brand I can't remember>, ...) all had nearly identical tubes, some Philips, some Goldstar or other. They were not great, but OK, given the resolution of OCS/ECS.

A 15kHz and up multiscan monitor enables you to run ECS video modes (productivity, DblPAL/NTSC) - flicker free, but reduced colors. If you're mostly into games, a standard 15kHz RGB monitor like the ones mentioned is the right choice - probably <10 USD/EUR @eBay or local garage sale.

If you want to do serious stuff, better get a multiscan monitor - but those actually capable of displaying 15kHz are rare nowadays. I had a Mitsubishi EUM1491 once (before my A3k w/ Flickerfixer) and is was absolutely great. Even featured a composite input for TV etc.
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Old 01-04-2006, 08:07 AM   #36
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Default Re: Monitors - Commodore or Philips?

NEC 3D .. 14.5" ? .. nooo.. you need a NEC 4PG.. at 27"! :-)
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Old 01-04-2006, 08:12 AM   #37
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Default Re: Monitors - Commodore or Philips?

Quote:
buzz wrote:
NEC 3D .. 14.5" ? .. nooo.. you need a NEC 4PG.. at 27"! :-)
lol, very "smashing" :-D
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Old 01-04-2006, 08:14 AM   #38
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Default Re: Monitors - Commodore or Philips?

@buzz wrote:
Quote:
NEC 3D .. 14.5" ? .. nooo.. you need a NEC 4PG.. at 27"!
www.rentex.com/descriptions.asp?id=375

0.75 dot pitch?! It's hurting my eyes!

Edit:
There's also one for sale on eBay:

http://cgi.ebay.de/NEC-MultiSync-4PG-Presentation-Multimedia-Monitor_W0QQitemZ8732226322QQcategoryZ174QQcmdZVie wItem

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Old 01-04-2006, 08:24 AM   #39
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Default Re: Monitors - Commodore or Philips?

It really shouldn't be a suprise that somebody made the monitors for Commodore. Up until LITON started manufacturing LCD screens in the mid 90s there were only three (yep 3) monitor manufacturers on the planet. Samsung/Samtron, Sony and Phillips. That's it. Everyone else bought tubes from one of those 3 companies and packaged it inside whatever case they created, slapped on their badge and started selling them.

Even today when you go buy a ViewSonic, DayTek, NEC, Envision, etc., monitor you're still buying a Sony, Phillips, or Samsung/Samtron tube. In the past 10 years there have been a few new tube manufacturers (Chunghwa, Weihai Daewoo, Huike and a couple others) but they're tiny (50,000-75,000 tubes per month) in comparison to the big three.

Now, if somebody could convince Phillips to start making 19 or 21 inch multisync (15->) monitors, and show them that the extra $4 per unit to manufacture would be recovered by PC (not Amiga) markets ("watch TV on your monitor, or use your computer", etc) we'd see some new monitors out there for the Amiga.

So uh, get busy with your pitch somebody. :-)
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Old 01-04-2006, 08:30 AM   #40
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Default Re: Monitors - Commodore or Philips?

just my 2 pence:

philips monitor dotn have good gripping in case for can9pin connector, 1084S-D1 have classic canon screws.

so, phillips can be (and will be, for sure) easy broken just with often plugging/unplugging that cable.
(years of experience)
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Old 01-04-2006, 08:36 AM   #41
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Default Re: Monitors - Commodore or Philips?

Quote:
0.75 dot pitch?! It's hurting my eyes!
Yeh. You shouldn't sit too close. But for games and demos its wonderful. Not really for general use :-)
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Old 01-04-2006, 08:37 AM   #42
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Default Re: Monitors - Commodore or Philips?

Wow. 50 eur. that's a bargain currently, but I guess shipping would be a bit expensive to here. I paid 40 for mine to be shipped within the same country :-)
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Old 01-04-2006, 09:33 AM   #43
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Default Re: Monitors - Commodore or Philips?

@steve30

I bet you confused now eh?

Let me clrify things.

The Commodore 1084 and 1084s are made by Philips......but as usual....PHILIPS gave themselves the upper hand on their version of the 1084 (CM8833)

How so? it does everything the 1084 does, except has more sharpness (but in a bad way) and a Super Cool Feature that no 1084 on this Planet that I have ever seen does.....................and that is it literally Resizes the screen in Realtime to Fit PAL and NTSC into the same space.unlike the 1084 which does display it.........but lines will get cut off unless you adjust the controls to resize the screen.

I dont know how the UK version works, I am speaking of the AMerican Version which is PHILIPS/MAGNAVOX equivalent of the CM8833.

I mentioned that the Sharpness on the CM8833/II is sharp in a bad way...........what I mean it is too sharp.......but still good............thats not a problem........as all 1084 and CM8833's have S-Video input which slightly blurrs those effects..........S-Video/Y/C is almost as clear as RGB...trust me. On top of that, you can connect a TV or VCR, or game system to both the 1084 and the Philips.

YOu need a special cable for S-Video.

as far as Flickering? just get Visual Prefs and Magic WB and you will be fine

The Philips is absolutely good for everyday use...........getting a Multiscan/sync means Losing Video Input and S-Video input


Bottom line. Get these in this order:

PHILIPS CM8833 II
1084s
PHILIPS TV with S-Video if you have S-Video out through a genlock or so
Visual PRefs (to reduce Flicker immensely)
Tools Daemon and Magic Menu (so that you wont have to open Drawers with flickering windows :-) (This is Amiga's Start Menu)

PHILPS TV's are CM8833 monitors without RGB inputs! some of them anyway. They adjust PAL in realtime and I suspect NTSC if your in the UK.


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Old 01-04-2006, 09:48 AM   #44
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Default Re: Monitors - Commodore or Philips?

Thanks leirbag28. That was useful.

I think I will be getting the CM8833-II as theirare a few on ebay at the moment that Ive got my eye on.

Video input is one of the things I like about these monitors. I really want to get back into using amigas all the time (instead of just occasionally for games) so I thought I could take the Amigas into the loft, set up a desk their and then use the monitors as TVs as well as the TV will be in my bedroom for when I'm using the PC.

Also if I need super high quality TV / Video I expect these will be ideal.


Thanks for everyones help.
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Old 01-04-2006, 09:53 AM   #45
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Default Re: Monitors - Commodore or Philips?

@leirbag28

I have seen some boxy 1084 monitors do that, resize NTSC or PAL screens, sadly the 1084D1/2 do not. I have a old 1084 in the box I should check and see if that does it. I do have a older Magnavox RGB80, I think this one also does that.
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