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[Darrin]

I like the way that Barry, sorry Wildstar128 thinks that we're the crazy ones, and not someone with a type AAA+ personality disorder who thought he could muscle in on an existing community, claim to be Jesus Christ and then dictate a new direction for the Amiga that happens to walk all over the existing x86 and Linux communities.

He also apparently thinks that the Hyperion/Amiga Inc settlement has forced C-USA to lie, insult and spam.

Finally, he thinks we are upset about what Barry hasn't done, while it is actually what he has done (lies, insults and spam).

You would think that the fact that we're debating this in a thread on Amiga.org and not CommodoreAmiga.net would make the bells ring as to who has the mental problems here.

[Tripitaka]

Originally Posted by Wildstar128

Shutup,

Put your $$$$ to invest in the brand, company, acquiring the rights. Just because you bought the computer. I been an owner of Commodore computer as far back as the 80s. You have no invested interest in the IP.

Your interest is selfish and to your own personal gain. You don't believe anyone should buy and make money on the brand or that they are going to be some 1 hour a month bull **** business that does nothing. You guys don't buy new hardware.

If you can't really make Jens Schonfeld and others what their economic worth it, then I would have a hard time believing your intent to support. Even then, it is hard to classify him and some of these folks real businesses. They are supporting quasi-businesses. As for thee hobby and quasi-projects... It will only go so long and then what? Maybe it is ti e the old hw is museum piece while you enjoy the spirit of it via emulation. Oh wait.... You already do that...well most of you.

How many of you use this for real life serious business and professional work use. If there is 100s of members registered to this forum and only a few talk, that isn't enough. 2-3 out of a 100... How many of you is it just a pass time weekend hobby. How much is it serious daily business and work use.

Painful reading. Is English a second language or are you still at school?

[psxphill]

Originally Posted by vox

It`s just isn`t a role model, think would you drive business same way if you were in charge. Even its retro time and globalization, as well as crisis. With Amiga its just different it`s not "just" retro, there is some community and it had some development, "a life after death", so C=USA isn`t a real comeback.

CUSA are following in the Commodore tradition of taking a good idea and completely screwing it up.

They are under no obligation to treat the Amiga name with the sanctity that you desire. You're better off just ignoring them.

[OlafS3]

+1

They made false promises and tried to be something they are not. They are only a very small company that acquired the right to sell PCs with "Amiga" on it. They have nothing innovative or special to offer (not even a special case) and their products are overprized. For me they are simply not interesting, I do noone of them wish something bad or "hate" but I do not care either and will certainly buy nothing from them. I think they were "hot" to get the brand but they had (and have) no product they can credible sell (something new/innovative). Mostly companies have products but no brand (and marketing). In both cases it fails...

[persia]

Think of CommodoreUSA as a large computer shop, but with fewer products.

[Wildstar128]

Originally Posted by Darrin

I like the way that Barry, sorry Wildstar128 thinks that we're the crazy ones, and not someone with a type AAA+ personality disorder who thought he could muscle in on an existing community, claim to be Jesus Christ and then dictate a new direction for the Amiga that happens to walk all over the existing x86 and Linux communities.

He also apparently thinks that the Hyperion/Amiga Inc settlement has forced C-USA to lie, insult and spam.

Finally, he thinks we are upset about what Barry hasn't done, while it is actually what he has done (lies, insults and spam).

You would think that the fact that we're debating this in a thread on Amiga.org and not CommodoreAmiga.net would make the bells ring as to who has the mental problems here.

LOL.... I wish because then I have the resources to acquire the IP. Sorry, I am not Barry.

To the point, put your money where your mouth is. You have no more of rights over intellectual property then 10 to 20 million Commodore owners who had first generation purchasing of Commodore products. First generation purchase: I mean, purchased from authorized Commodore distribution and had the official warranties with Commodore or at least qualified. In other words, you didn't get your first Commodore from another another customer.

As for feeling that you guys think they have any rights over the trademark with all about 10-11 full pages worth of questions that are really unrealistic claims.

What I am trying to get at is why you guys waste so many pages of questions that you already know the answer is that the your suggestions are totally useless and only serves less than a 1000 individuals worldwide. Real companies for international commercial trade of goods requires a market base of at least a million potential customers.

If you have potential customer base of 1000 individuals then you have to spend no more then $100 in R&D.

[Wildstar128]

Originally Posted by Tripitaka

Painful reading. Is English a second language or are you still at school?

Trip,

I guess so when it was 3:## AM at USA pacific coast time. Give it a wild guess and figure that I was up since 8:30 AM of the preceeding day.

[OlafS3]

"utter bull**** questions", "shut the **** up", "you guys are a buch of screwed up dellusional nut jobs" ...

Please act and communicate politely and civilised here, even on internet people should not be different to normal life or is this the way you always talk to other people?

I do not understand what you talk about between all those "ass****" phrases... We all know that there is a big outside world but Barry and his company do not serious play in this league. Selling is satisfying consumer needs. What need are they satisfying? To have a amiga-sticker on a case? People are not as stupid as some seem to think...

[tone007]

Originally Posted by Darrin

I like the way that Barry, sorry Wildstar128 thinks that we're the crazy ones

Unfortunately, Wildstar really isn't Barry.

http://www.archivum.info/comp.sys.cb...y-Nov.-19.html

Another nut in Commodore/Amigaland! Who would've guessed?!

[TheDaddy]

@Wildstar128

oooohhh...massive mistake taking on Darrin and the rest of the amiga.org community....that is going to hurt. Nice meeting you.

[DutchinUSA]

Guys, don't feed the troll

He/she be

[commodorejohn]

Originally Posted by Wildstar128

The problem with so many of you is you are demanding CommodoreUSA to fulfill Escom's bull**** and trying to start from 1993 tech. Guess what, motorola has stopped major advancement in the 68k processor. The fastest one is the 68k coldfire and some under the dragonball name from Motorola/Freescale. It is dated and slow. 266 MHz? Um... Well overclock... 300 Mhz.

My bone to pick with the nut jobs on this forum is in nearly 20 years since the last Amiga model was introduced, would you want an Amiga for your day to day regular mainstream computer that compares with your actual paid job or even the kind of job you had got your original Amiga. How many of you got the Amiga 4000 and other power house for movie and other professional graphics work. Would that Natami or other Amiga clones even meet the scrutiny and power and capability that your work place would need today. Would it meet the needs of George Lucas and others. Lets get serious. Amiga was the graphic minicomputer workstation for the masses that can sit on your desk. That kind of professional stature and ability is exactly the kind of stuff Amiga was remembered for. A modern Amiga line must model as a premier of quality graphics with strong grahic facilities. Amiga models with wacoms and various professional graphic software suites for the sectors in professional graphics like DTP, movie & TV CGI, CAD/Arch/engineering, etc.

Actually, some of us remember the Amiga for (get this) being a really neat design in both hardware and software, not for giving Amiga owners a bigger e-penis than PC owners. I don't really care what clock speed is or isn't attained, I'd just like to see a new computer that's a worthy follow-up to what was really an amazingly elegant system for its day.

Barry was very much in place where it really was used and knows first hand what Amiga was about for much of Amiga history beyond the video games which was captured in the Amiga 500 more then anything.

So? The exact same can be said about nearly everybody else in this community. It's not like Barry was present on the mountain with Carl Sassenrath and Dave Haynie for the Transfiguration of Jay Miner. How does this make him any more qualified to do anything Amiga-related than anybody else here?

Originally Posted by Wildstar128

Your interest is selfish and to your own personal gain. You don't believe anyone should buy and make money on the brand or that they are going to be some 1 hour a month bull **** business that does nothing. You guys don't buy new hardware.

Uh, wait, we "don't buy new hardware?" How is it that the first run of the X1000 sold out and they're doing a second run, then? Unless you mean we don't buy new hardware that's assembled from stock PC components we could get for less than half the cost, perhaps?

Even then, it is hard to classify him and some of these folks real businesses. They are supporting quasi-businesses.

What's your criteria for a "real business?"

Originally Posted by Wildstar128

To the point, put your money where your mouth is. You have no more of rights over intellectual property then 10 to 20 million Commodore owners who had first generation purchasing of Commodore products.

So? Doesn't mean we're obligated to agree with or approve of the doings of any random schmoe who's shelled out to Bill McEwen.

What I am trying to get at is why you guys waste so many pages of questions that you already know the answer is that the your suggestions are totally useless and only serves less than a 1000 individuals worldwide.

I'll remind you that this whole thing was Barry's idea. He asked for questions and we gave him questions; if they weren't the questions he wanted, that's his problem.

[Wildstar128]

Originally Posted by commodorejohn

Actually, some of us remember the Amiga for (get this) being a really neat design in both hardware and software, not for giving Amiga owners a bigger e-penis than PC owners. I don't really care what clock speed is or isn't attained, I'd just like to see a new computer that's a worthy follow-up to what was really an amazingly elegant system for its day.

So? The exact same can be said about nearly everybody else in this community. It's not like Barry was present on the mountain with Carl Sassenrath and Dave Haynie for the Transfiguration of Jay Miner. How does this make him any more qualified to do anything Amiga-related than anybody else here?


Uh, wait, we "don't buy new hardware?" How is it that the first run of the X1000 sold out and they're doing a second run, then? Unless you mean we don't buy new hardware that's assembled from stock PC components we could get for less than half the cost, perhaps?

What's your criteria for a "real business?"


So? Doesn't mean we're obligated to agree with or approve of the doings of any random schmoe who's shelled out to Bill McEwen.

I'll remind you that this whole thing was Barry's idea. He asked for questions and we gave him questions; if they weren't the questions he wanted, that's his problem.

First, I am not afraid the 90% of wackos with maybe 10% actually have grown up and matured somewhat.

Second, if we want to be civilized, fine. Lets go with that but seriously if you want to ask someone who is investing a bit of his or her own money as well as serious business venture capitalists then you better stop with silly notions of ressurecting antiquate technology that not even god and Jay Miner combined could compete with todays tech. Guess what, new inventions came about since then and are fully patented. They aren't sharing their golden goose with anyone unless you talk big bucks like big bucks for even the likes of Bill Gates.

Commodore USA makes more money per year then every single Commodore 8 Bit and Amiga hobbyist-business makes from sales combined. Every one of you except maybe Jim Brain loses money and every one of you can't pay yourself on any classic hardware venture.

Why? There just is not enough people using the real hardware. Many of you collected them but nearly none of you use the hardware. So what is the experience for you now? Virtual emulated hardware. Nearly implies there is a few. I am not arguing that.

The next computer "revolution" isn't going to happen for probably 60 years. 30 years to make a viable quantum processor. Another 30 years red taped by National Security Agency of the NWO - the American Global Empire of the world. So, it isn't going to be seen for long after most of you are dead or wrinkled up old men and some women.

I challenge you to come up with a serious plan for product that can be sold to hundreds of thousands of people. I challenge you in this for a product that sustains interst in the Commodore brand, new and even old technology and support.

The interesting thing is, Commodore USA has helped in slowing down the eroding members of the Commodore community. If you paid attention, you probably seen some new faces or faces from old Commodore users from the 80s that left in the late 80s and early 90s reconnecting with Commodore technology and community. Something that has in fact help to slow down the decline.

However, old tech like the c64 and all of the classic Amiga models even with the best PPC cards ever made are really not up to the task of contemporary computing in any viable way.

I'll ask you to a task, design a 4500 sq.ft. House, two stories and prepare construction documents with visual rendering, mass model in a google earth visualization, I would need foundation plans, wall plans with proper national cad standards (US) in US measurements, roof plans, framing plan and door and window schedules. All the Construction document information must meet the following plan standards on 24x36 sheets and be distributed in PDF format. The CAD files must be distributed in Google Sketchup, .dwg files (autocad 2006 and after compatible) and Archicad/revit formats of the IFC formats supported by Revit and ArchiCad and other BIM tools.

Plan standards - http://ncbdc.com/plan_standards.htm

They shall be done in 30 days. I want to see that done all on the ol' Amiga PPC computers.

We can do that on Windows, Linux (COS-V included), MacOS X but are your Amiga system efficiently up to the task to meet the interoperability of various consultants tool chains as well as your own as the lead design professional.

I understand this isn't how you use the computer but Amiga and Commodore 8 bit were designed for serious use at their time. The demand of what computers are expected to do has changed alot. We now have sophisticated networking interoperability.

Commodore USA is looking for products that will serve as primary use like your primary computer. They aren't looking at selling products that would be used part-time. Computers are a tool.

The majority of the people, computer is an investment. As in "for work and for play". The point is accurate to what computers are suppose to be used for work as well as for entertainment. It wasn't manufactured or produced to be desk decoration.

It is like asking Ford to produce model T's for only a cople hundred people a decade just so they are garage decoration. Seriously, it isn't going to happen unless there is ROI.

Most of you obviously don't run any real or serious business of any kind. If you had, you guys would not waste someone's who is running an actual business with no viable business plan.

Have or does any of you actually work for a serious company with lead managing roles of projects and project proposals. Try being more serious next time with a real proposal with seious investigation on return on investment.

Commodore USA is a business not a hobby shop.

I am not saying if I agree with Barry on everything. I don't but at least there is something.

To the dumbass who made a comment about forgetting a fan and referencing that person's 12 year old. geez, you know, that 12 year old had a captive instruction as in the child is doing what you tell the child to do vs. Doing anything on his or her own or on any real full education on computer science. The child is just getting one person's perspective and view.

Factors not considered might be.... The low power usage modes and subsequent heat emissions of the hardware. Netbook hardware without high power draw cpu? Wow....

Each cpu has a certain amount of energy efficiency of input energy and loss emitted as heat due to inefficiency. That is back to basic physics 101. It might not need a fan in the c64x. Given the bulky size and air space and energy efficiency of board chips and their thermal emission. If you done the research, it probably not that big an issue.

I read alot of emotional b.s. Nonsense throughout this thread.

I wish you guys grow up somewhat. Especially the ones demanding the most ridiculous claims.

You can prop yourselves like a bunch of walking phallics or you can provide reasonable solutions that makes sense in a practical functional business.

CMD left over a decade ago. That was the last real business supporting Commodore 8 bit from a development standpoint. jens is close and so is some but they are more quasi-business and hobby. Jens, I am not claiming your skill as hobbyist but your Commodore/Amiga business is somewhere between full fledge business and a hobby using your professional knowledge in hardware engineering but I doubt you are naive to make your living on Commodore and Amiga these days.

My point for the rest of you, how long would great guys like Jens and Jim and others be able to do this and to what extent. I am sure some of these guys could use some degree of support financially to offset some of their hard labor cost. I think that maybe an option if Barry considers it and if it is done in a manner acceptable to all parties.

Some of that is reasonable but that may or may not be out of Commodore USA, LLC. Business budget but maybe out of some personal money. The biggest thing is, would both sides be willing to come to the table in a civil manner with intelligent and professional quality planning.

Simply put, if you guys just knock off the silly crap then great. If you were employees and I was the CEO and I got this kind of response.... It would be hard pressed for me to not give most of you the pink slip.

PS: I am not one to sugar coat my point that much.

[runequester]

But if it's all big business, why bother?

Dell will sell me a much cheaper PC, I can use my employee discount with them, I can install the exact same emulator stuff there and I can install any version of linux I want anyways.
I can go to System 76 and get a pre-installed and tested linux PC, and still pay less money.

If I am a serious computer user, why on earth would I invest in "commodore" in 2012?



You can play big business or you can play hobby, but you don't get to do it both ways.

[Darrin]

Originally Posted by Wildstar128

LOL.... I wish because then I have the resources to acquire the IP. Sorry, I am not Barry.

Well your posting style at 3am after a night on the town exactly matches Barry's style at midday after a cup of coffee. An easy mistake to make.

To the point, put your money where your mouth is. You have no more of rights over intellectual property then 10 to 20 million Commodore owners who had first generation purchasing of Commodore products. First generation purchase: I mean, purchased from authorized Commodore distribution and had the official warranties with Commodore or at least qualified. In other words, you didn't get your first Commodore from another another customer.

I have put my money where my mouth is. Over the last couple of years I've purchased Keyrahs, RTG cards, SDFFs, card readers, Amiga/C64 Forever, a Chameleon64, a C-One, a Minimig and ARM board, an FPGA Aracde and pre-ordered an X1000.

What have you done?

I've bought several PCs too, but I got them from HP. More powerful than C-USA can do and a fraction of the price. My C64 Forever and Amiga Forever still run on them though.

As for feeling that you guys think they have any rights over the trademark with all about 10-11 full pages worth of questions that are really unrealistic claims.

Yeah, expecting Barry to just bugger off and sell some PCs is unrealistic. However, we live in hope.

What I am trying to get at is why you guys waste so many pages of questions that you already know the answer is that the your suggestions are totally useless and only serves less than a 1000 individuals worldwide. Real companies for international commercial trade of goods requires a market base of at least a million potential customers.

If this was "wasting pages" then we would be posting on CommodoreAmiga.net. This is the site we have all used for years to discuss the Amiga variations. C-USA insist on coming here and posting rubbish and as we're here we feel the need to respond. If they're not interested in what we think then they should stop posting here. They keep telling us we're not their target customers so why on Earth do they keep coming back?

If you have potential customer base of 1000 individuals then you have to spend no more then $100 in R&D.

Better than that, I don't need to spend a penny on R&D because others (MikeJ, aCube, Hyperion, Indivision, etc) are already doing it and have been for years. I just by the finished products as I pointed out above.