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Old 01-24-2012, 11:28 AM   #21
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Default Re: How to stop Deneb splash screen

OK, well scratch what I said last time. The machine did boot, but the reason Trident said it couldn't find a Deneb board was because I hadn't reseated it fully in the card slot after setting the "No ROM" jumper. I also realized that there were no green LED's on on the Deneb.

So I reseated the card fully and rebooted. Now the machine won't boot at all. The No Rom jumper is in place, the top two LED's on the Deneb are lit ("FPGA booted" and "Zorro II mode"), but absolutely nothing happens, no disk activity or anything. It won't even boot from DF0.

I did the L-R mouse button boot and ran the Expansion Board Diagnostic. This is what I got:

Board Number Manufacturer Product Status
1 514 81 Working
2 514 3 Working
3 4626 23 Working
4 3643 18 Working
4 3643 19 Working
5 513 1 Working

The Deneb is board no. 4, mfr. 3643. According to the Deneb manual, this should show up as Products 18 and 20. I'm seeing 18 and 19. Is this (part of) the problem?

The current configuration, looking from the front is

Slot Board
1 empty
2 A2088
3 Deneb
4 Xsurf
5 A2091
6 empty
CPU A2630 with DKB2632

If I pull the Deneb out, it boots normally. Any ideas? I'm starting to wish I had just left the fool thing alone. At least before I reflashed the ROM, it was working.

Update: After about a dozen reboot attempts, I got it to boot off the Emergency OS 3.9 floppy, with the jumper removed on the Deneb. But now when I click on Trident, I get an error "Failed to load version 3 of Poseidon.library". All I can do then is click "Cancel". What's that all about?

Update 2: OK, I figured out how to assign the libs: so Trident was happy. Now in Trident I click to the Controllers panel and see Unit = 0, Online = No, and Product = unknown until online. So I click on the "Online" button at the bottom of the window and I get an error:

"Failure poseidon.library Opening DEVS:USBHardware unit 0 failed deviceInit failed to open(-1)".

This message is repeated three times. Now what?

Update 3: Just for laughs, I tried running Luciferin again. This time I get a pop-up error

"Your Deneb card has the ROM-OFF jumper set and thus the Flashrom contents are currently "DEACTIVATED" until you remove the jumper. This is only an information."

But I removed the jumper one or two reboots ago! This is shall we say, slightly mystifying.

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Old 01-24-2012, 02:06 PM   #22
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Default Re: How to stop Deneb splash screen

Have you tried inserting Deneb in another zorro slot (for example the first empty one you got)?
Also, what version of Poseidon are you installing? Version 3 of Poseidon in your message is old stuff. You should get the newer version from Chris Hodges website here: http://www.platon42.de/index2.html
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Old 01-24-2012, 03:04 PM   #23
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Default Re: How to stop Deneb splash screen

"Have you tried inserting Deneb in another zorro slot (for example the first empty one you got)?"

No I haven't. I only have one empty one all the way to the right, but I can't use it because the 2632 blocks it. I could try pulling the 2088 and moving the Deneb one slot to the left.

"Also, what version of Poseidon are you installing?"

Yup - 3.0. That's what came with the Deneb. Thanks for the link. I grabbed the latest Poseidon and Trident and will install them tonight.
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Old 01-24-2012, 06:56 PM   #24
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Default Re: How to stop Deneb splash screen

Um, I have a stupid question - if the only way I can get the machine to boot is by inserting the Deneb "no rom" jumper, but Luciferin refuses to rewrite the rom when that jumper is in place, then how the heck can I ever change the contents of the rom?
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Old 01-24-2012, 09:03 PM   #25
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Default Re: How to stop Deneb splash screen

Get Poseidon 4.4 installed first and report back.

Did you try the "hold left mouse button to disable Flash" trick I mentioned earlier? The board ships with the settings I described, so unless a previous owner changed them, you should be able to disable the Flash in software.

Your Deneb may need a firmware update as well, but let's not introduce that variable just yet.
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Old 01-24-2012, 11:27 PM   #26
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Default Re: How to stop Deneb splash screen

This is a strange default feature. Does everyone who doesn't want to be annoyed all the time have to go through this whole Luciferin mess?
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Old 01-25-2012, 02:15 AM   #27
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Default Re: How to stop Deneb splash screen

This is no mess at all. Luciferin is easy stuff, it just needs a bit of attention.

Btw I dont' recall Deneb coming with Poseidon 3.x
I got one of the first Denebs in first run and it came with Poseidon 4.0 burned into it's unwritable flash memory so you could install it easily with it! No floppy disks required to get it up and running!
When you get Deneb the jumper is set to RES position in which the Unwritable flash is enabled so you can install Poseidon. After you install you power off Amiga, and put the jumper in SPR position.
It's all written in the manual.
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Old 01-25-2012, 12:38 PM   #28
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Default Re: How to stop Deneb splash screen

"Luciferin is easy stuff, it just needs a bit of attention."

Sure - it's easy once you know how it works.

"Btw I dont' recall Deneb coming with Poseidon 3.x"

Well mine did. I bought it brand new from Amikit on 8/6/08 and followed the installation directions exactly. I never downloaded any Deneb software from anywhere else, so that's the only place 3.0 could have been.
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Old 01-25-2012, 12:56 PM   #29
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Default Re: How to stop Deneb splash screen

Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt_H View Post
Get Poseidon 4.4 installed first and report back.

Did you try the "hold left mouse button to disable Flash" trick I mentioned earlier? The board ships with the settings I described, so unless a previous owner changed them, you should be able to disable the Flash in software
Poseidon 4.4 downloaded and installed without problems. I also installed the new version of Luciferin - again it installed OK.

Thanks for reminding me about the left-button boot. I just missed that somehow. I tried that and hey presto, it booted normally from the hard drive with the Deneb installed with no jumpers on it.

So I fired up Trident and clicked on "Controllers". This time I saw this:

USB Hardware Contollers available

Name Unit Online Product

denebz2usb.device 0 Yes Deneb EHCI USB Host Controller
denebpiousb.device 0 No unknown until online


So that's different! Last time, this pane was empty. So we're clearly making some major progress. Can you tell me exactly what I need to do now to get the pio device (which is apprently screwing things up) out of the ROM? I'm so paranoid about this now I don't want to screw it up. Thanks.
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Old 01-25-2012, 01:28 PM   #30
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Default Re: How to stop Deneb splash screen

Just select the denebpiousb.device and click delete to remove it permanently.
Just leave the denebz2usb.device and hit online. If it turns up Green then you're ok and you only need to press SAVE and reboot
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Old 01-25-2012, 02:21 PM   #31
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Default Re: How to stop Deneb splash screen

And that deletes it from the Flash rom too? I thought I had to use Luciferin to do that.

By the way, even without clicking on anything in Trident yet, I noticed that my USB stick is now showing up on the WB screen, and when I open it, my files are all there.
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Old 01-25-2012, 02:26 PM   #32
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Default Re: How to stop Deneb splash screen

No it doesn't delete it. Poseidon doesn't have to do anything with the Flash.
I just told you to delete one of the 2 entries in Poseidon's configudation.
You ought to have only one entry per device. Alas since you only have one Deneb and it operates in Z2 mode, you only need the Z2 Deneb device and delete any other.
Seeing your USB stick under WB is a good sign

Also check what you have in your Flash via Luciferin. My advice would be to save a Flash with nothing on for starters to be sure you don't need to press Left Mouse Button on boot to disable what exists in there every time.
Empty it all, and if everything works fine, start filling the Flash with any module you feel best
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Old 01-25-2012, 02:51 PM   #33
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Default Re: How to stop Deneb splash screen

OK, I think I've got it now. I deleted the pio device using Trident and then saved that. Then I used Luciferin to reflash the rom with nothing in it. Then I I did a normal reboot (no mouse buttons presses, and no jumpers on Deneb). Surprise - everything came right up, including the icon for the USB stick! I guess I thought all that poseidon stuff was required to be in the flash rom in order for the Deneb to work but apparently that isn't the case.

So I guess the only remaining question is, if I'm not planning to boot from a USB device, do I really need to store anything in the flash rom at all?

Anyway, thanks very much to you and Matt for helping me figure out this Chinese puzzle.
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Old 01-25-2012, 03:25 PM   #34
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Default Re: How to stop Deneb splash screen

Quote:
Originally Posted by Michele31415 View Post
So I guess the only remaining question is, if I'm not planning to boot from a USB device, do I really need to store anything in the flash rom at all?
Short answer: No.

The only thing I actually have on my ROM are the two modules to stop my floppy clicking and to disable the IDE port on the A4000 motherboard to speed up booting (I have a FastATA4000).
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Old 01-25-2012, 03:55 PM   #35
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Default Re: How to stop Deneb splash screen

Hooray! You should do a cold restart to make sure everything still works with an empty Flash.

A bit more on how this all works: Your Poseidon configuration is saved in a combined config file/executable. Can't recall the name off the top of my head, but running that file will bring the stack online, and I believe the Poseidon installer adds it to user-startup by default. So that might be why your USB stick shows up on a no-Flash boot. As Darrin says, you can run without the Flash completely if you prefer.

Because your settings are in that one file, if you change the configuration you need to re-upload the Flash to make sure the USB drivers are receiving the right settings from a cold start.

So it sounds like you've got a good, safe config file. Now you should be able to run Quick Setup from the Luciferin menu to have everything important automatically set to get uploaded to Flash.

One question, though, have you had your USB stick plugged in this whole time? With Poseidon's default settings, my machine would hang with a USB stick inserted on boot. Something to do with timeout settings. Changed those, re-uploaded the Flash, and now everything works. I wonder if you were running into something similar?
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Old 01-25-2012, 04:03 PM   #36
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Default Re: How to stop Deneb splash screen

As Darrin said... No
Deneb's flash is an awesome feature that works awesomely well and easy. Just use what it feels best for you. Stuffing it with things you don't know it's not good.

The fact that you have your USB showing upon boot is because of User-Startup's "PsdStackLoader" running upon boot
That initializes the stack based on your saved configuration alas all is working.

I'm glad you sort it out in the end. It's not so difficult, it's just need some understanding on how the device works and you're set.

Cheers

P.S. Matt_H got me this time
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Old 01-25-2012, 05:43 PM   #37
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Default Re: How to stop Deneb splash screen

Quote:
Originally Posted by mfilos View Post
P.S. Matt_H got me this time
But PsdStackLoader is the name of the file I couldn't remember. It's a team effort
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Old 01-25-2012, 06:08 PM   #38
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Smile Re: How to stop Deneb splash screen

Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt_H View Post
One question, though, have you had your USB stick plugged in this whole time? With Poseidon's default settings, my machine would hang with a USB stick inserted on boot. Something to do with timeout settings. Changed those, re-uploaded the Flash, and now everything works. I wonder if you were running into something similar?
Yes! When I first installed the board, I saw the internal port and thought to myself, what good is that? The obvious answer is a USB thumb drive to use for backups. So that was the first thing I added and it's been there ever since.

What's odd is that I only started experiencing total boot failure after I tried reflashing the ROM. Another weird thing is that every time I booted the Deneb intro always played twice, right from the very beginning. Originally I assumed that was just the way it was. Now I'm thinking the machine was doing an unasked for reboot after the first time through DenebIntro.

In retrospect, three things were key in solving this problem. First was using the left button boot to get the machine to even start up at all. Second was downloading the latest Trident. And third was removing the pio device from the flash rom. I did a cold boot and everything is still good.

I was greatly confused by the presence of two different utilities, Trident and Luciferin, both purporting to influence the operation of Deneb. And with no real documentaiton about what they do or how to use them, I was pretty much lost. So many thanks again to everyone who helped me bring this problemn to a successful conclusion. You guys are awesome.
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Old 01-25-2012, 07:18 PM   #39
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Default Re: How to stop Deneb splash screen

Are you running 3.9? Sounds like your machine is resetting after applying SetPatch.
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Old 01-26-2012, 03:31 AM   #40
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Default Re: How to stop Deneb splash screen

Seeing the intro two times means that you indeed you have OS3.9 (as I can see from your signature as well).
OS3.9 Reboots your machine when the SetPatch runs in Startup-Sequence (in order to load the updated modules of the file "AmigaOS ROM Update" that resides in DEVS).

Since Deneb loads by default the flash in every reboot, that's why you saw the Intro 2 times in every power on
You can disable the Intro Logo ofc by clicking the left mouse button but after some time... even that... gets irritating lol

I'd suggest at a point to put Kickstart 3.9 Modules inside Deneb to have a rebootless system that boost faster
I can help you with that if you can't make it on your own.

Cheers
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