Following orders, Lynndie England style

[KennyR]

Or not. Who gave Lynndie England the order to do this (http://www.nypost.com/news/nationalnews/20802.htm)? Hugh Hefner?

"She was having sex with numerous partners. It appeared to be consensual," said a lawmaker who saw the photos. "Almost everybody was naked all the time," another lawmaker said.

Great to be able to spread our wonderful Western morality to the barbarous masses, isn't it? Just gotta love the discipline and moral backbone of the military.

But I love this quote:

Sen. Dianne Feinstein (D-Calif.), who also characterized the photos as "disgusting," agreed, noting, "It's hard to believe that this actually is taking place in a military facility."

:lol: Senator Dianne Feinstein hasn't been in many barracks towns, has she? This is about average par for some places. :)

[T_Bone]

Sounds like a bad late night womens prison B-movie.

[Speelgoedmannetje]

@KennyR
????????????????????????

You want unfree BEAUROCRACY??????????

[KennyR]

What on earth has beurocracy got to do with this, Speel?

[cecilia]

obviously her lawyer told here to say this:
"I was instructed by persons in higher rank to 'stand there, hold this leash, look at the camera,' and they took picture for PsyOps [psychological operations]," she told KCNC-TV.and England has refused to identify who gave her the orders, saying only that they came from "persons in my chain of command."

it's all really stupid.
you can't play with people like they are toys.

i don't like it when idiots do this is college club hazings, either.

[sumner7]

It has nothing to do with it, does it KennyR? Speel's just not making sense yet again.

[Speelgoedmannetje]

Sorry to become arrogant,
I feel to good for the politics CH and I leave here and I do not return here.

The politics CH is short-sighted, repetitive, and just plain boring and annoying.

If you're too dumb to understand something SO obvious, then SHUT IT already?

[Glaucus]

T_Bone wrote:
Sounds like a bad late night womens prison B-movie.If the abuse wasn't for real, then this would make a GREAT late night women's B-Movie! ;-)

- Mike

[cecilia]

oh, speel, don't run away, he's just a kid.

i wasn't sure what you were referring to here, but that's an issue of translation, not lack of intelligence (yours).
explain away! :-D

[KennyR]

Speelgoedmannetje wrote:
Sorry to become arrogant,
I feel to good for the politics CH and I leave here and I do not return here.

The politics CH is short-sighted, repetitive, and just plain boring and annoying.

If you're too dumb to understand something SO obvious, then SHUT IT already?

No, actually, I won't. I want to know why you think that abuse of prisoners in an Iraqi jail has anything to do with "unfree beureucracy".

beureucracy

1.
a. Administration of a government chiefly through bureaus or departments staffed with nonelected officials.

b.The departments and their officials as a group: promised to reorganize the federal bureaucracy.

2. a. Management or administration marked by hierarchical authority among numerous offices and by fixed procedures: The new department head did not know much about bureaucracy.
b. The administrative structure of a large or complex organization: a midlevel manager in a corporate bureaucracy.

3. An administrative system in which the need or inclination to follow rigid or complex procedures impedes effective action: innovative ideas that get bogged down in red tape and bureaucracy.

So tell me, with the prisoner abuse going on that certainly isn't anything to do with those in power, how exactly has beaureucracy got anything to do with this situation?

Or has the one who's calling me dumb stupidly decided not to click the link, misunderstood, and gone off in one of his ultraliberal sulks in a mindset were having depraved gangbangs in public is the norm?

[Speelgoedmannetje]

oh, speel, don't run away, he's just a kid.
Okay, I'll stay to answer a bit, but for the rest, I'm outta here.

So tell me, with the prisoner abuse going on that certainly isn't anything to do with those in power, how exactly has beaureucracy got anything to do with this situation?
'overregulation' and controlling these things is according to the righty wingy USies not something desireable. International law... BUREAUCRACY! I hoped you would understand my (obvious) sarcasm.

btw. I don't like the 'parental' attitude like: aw, tis just Eyso again.:roll:

[KennyR]

'overregulation' and controlling these things is according to the righty wingy USies not something desireable. International law... BUREAUCRACY! I hoped you would understand my (obvious) sarcasm.

WHAT???!?

Regulating and controlling how prisoners are treated and not having sex in front of them or humiliating them or beating them is BUREAUCRACY??

WTF have you been smoking? This woman's crimes (yes, CRIMES) have got a man murdered and will result in the deaths of hundreds of UK and US soldiers.

So I was right. You didn't read the fcuking link, did you? I'm not attacking the woman for being a slut, I'm attacking her for sexually abusing prisoners in her care!

[Speelgoedmannetje]

KennyR wrote:
'overregulation' and controlling these things is according to the righty wingy USies not something desireable. International law... BUREAUCRACY! I hoped you would understand my (obvious) sarcasm.

WHAT???!?

Regulating and controlling how prisoners are treated and not having sex in front of them or humiliating them or beating them is BUREAUCRACY??
what's so difficult about the term S-A-R-C-A-S-M?

[KennyR]

what's so difficult about the term S-A-R-C-A-S-M?

Seems to be quite a bit, since you don't seem to have mastered it at all yet. Any more big words to throw around completely out of context? No, my fault, I'm just guilty of COLONIALISM! or SYCOPHANCY!!! or just plain ANTIDISESTABLISHMENTARIANISM!!!!!!!!

That's sarcasm, good isn't it?

I thought you were going to leave the politics thread, anyway? Why not go to General and start throwing your unwarranted out of context accusations around there instead?

[Speelgoedmannetje]

Yup, I'm goin'

've been in Babylon for too long..

[KennyR]

Good. I eagerly await your explosions of BEUREURACY! in the threads about old TV shows and heavy metal.

(More sarcasm.)

[Wilse]

@cecilia:

I laughed my erse off when I saw her on Fox the other night,
saying she didn't want to be in the photo, quickly following
up with "I didn't want to be in *any* pictures!"

Stupid feminazi probably forgot about that shot of her
grinning, cigarette between teeth, giving the double thumbs
up-finger point to some bloke who was masturbating with a
sandbag on his head.

sure you didn't want to be in it, that's why you look so f*cking
delighted, isn't it?

Evil cow deserves everything that's coming to her.

I also like the way they describe the rape of an Iraqi woman
as "having sexual intercourse with a detainee".

C*nts.

[cecilia]

Wilse wrote:
@cecilia:

I laughed my erse off when I saw her on Fox the other night,
saying she didn't want to be in the photo, quickly following
up with "I didn't want to be in *any* pictures!"

Stupid feminazi probably forgot about that shot of her
grinning, cigarette between teeth, giving the double thumbs
up-finger point to some bloke who was masturbating with a
sandbag on his head.

sure you didn't want to be in it, that's why you look so f*cking delighted, isn't it?

Evil cow deserves everything that's coming to her.
.Yeah, her excuse sounded VERY lame to me!

I'm going to sound like a horrible bit6h (like i care :lol: ), but my impression - and i have no proof, it's just a feeling - is that she is So ugly and this was her big chance to have alot of crasy sex and she took it.
and Oops! the pictures got back to the rest of the world, where we aren't quite as nuts and now she's in deep sh*t.

I suspect that alot more people knew about this, but i'll wait for the investigation before i go slamming anyone else.

I'm REALLY offended by the fact that this will put people in harms way (like the hatefilled kooks need more excuses!) and that this behavior reflects back to people who would NEVER imagine doing such things!

thanks, bit6h!

:admonish:

[Karlos]

Wilse wrote:

Evil cow deserves everything that's coming to her.

I also like the way they describe the rape of an Iraqi woman
as "having sexual intercourse with a detainee".

C*nts.

Problem is, nothing of any real consequence will come to them.

[smerf]

Hi,

@Karlos,

***Problem is, nothing of any real consequence will come to them.***

Yea, maybe we should put them on trial and then read the koran and then cut off their heads like they did to Nick Berg for the evil tortorous things that these people have done to the Iraqi prisoners. That would really make them pay.

We should have an American head cut off for every masturbation that these Iraqi prisoners have done.

smerf

lets get real here.

[Karlos]

@smerf

I don't defend the action of those who decapitated Nick Berg.

Nor do I defend the actions carried out in Abu Graib.

If you were held in prison and forced into lewd acts for the amusement of some gun weilding sickos, wouldn't you want those people tried?

If someone held your mother/sister/daughter in prison, sexually assaulted her would you demand justice?

Or would you sit back and think, "well I didn't do anything, but these people were well within their rights to detain me, humiliate me, torture me for no reason whatsoever. I don't think they deserve to be punished for their actions in any way."

If you think sexual assault, rape etc. is not worth prosecuting then you are an even bigger ar*ehole than I had you down for. And believe me, that is saying something.

[smerf]

Hi,

@Karlos,

"If you were held in prison and forced into lewd acts for the amusement of some gun weilding sickos, wouldn't you want those people tried?"

Well would being hung up in the air by my wrists with my arms tied behind my back and being dropped four feet count?

Would being stripped of my clothes and being beaten by bamboo sticks count and then being forced to stand for a couple of days count?

"How about having a gun placed to my head?"

been there done that

I would say that just being stripped nude and having some girl embarass me would have been a cake walk. I know of others though that would have been happy with what I went through, like the three Marines we came across that were skinned alive, and then salt thrown on their bodes tied upside down and left to hang in the hot sun. So tell me about how bad these Americans tortured these people, no I don't condone (say it was right) but where the hell is your voice and the voice of all your associates when this happens to an American?

Maybe we should walk up to these prisoners of war and say here have a cup of tea and tell me where your army is at waiting to attack us.

Could you please tell me where your gang is hidden? Pretty please on ice cream, I'll give you money if you tell me?

The rules state that we can use mental duress to get information but can cause no bodily harm, this means we can use mind games to get info, but cannot bodily harm these people. A little embarrassment on their part to save lives on both parties engaged in war is worth it don't you think?

To the people that this happened with I am sorry this is war, thats how I had to take it, the only difference is that you had the Genevia convention to protect you, I on the other hand wasn't so lucky this country didn't believe in the convention.

Have a nice day?
And go play out in the middle of a busy road with a blind fold on so that you might really be able to see what life is about.

smerf

[KennyR]

Shut up Smerf. I'm not even going to answer any of points, because you're a fcuking idiot and wouldn't understand big words anyway. If you think that sexual torture is justified against prisoners of war, then I sincerely hope Al-Qaida catch you and cut your head off next time. Judging by what you write, your IQ wouldn't suffer much.

"How about having a gun placed to my head?"

been there done that

And why aren't we surprised?

[FluffyMcDeath]

On a slightly related note....

Travel, kill people, and knock up your fellow soldiers in the Army (http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/articleshow/743101.cms)

[Karlos]

@Smerf,

. So tell me about how bad these Americans tortured these people, no I don't condone (say it was right) but where the hell is your voice and the voice of all your associates when this happens to an American?


Show me one place where I have *ever* condoned torture of any form to any person of any nationality, Smerf. Please, it seems I'm having some difficulty in remembering.


"If you were held in prison and forced into lewd acts for the amusement of some gun weilding sickos, wouldn't you want those people tried?"

Well would being hung up in the air by my wrists with my arms tied behind my back and being dropped four feet count?

Of course. Wouldn't you want the people responsible brought to justice (assuming that it was possible, of course)?

I would say that just being stripped nude and having some girl embarass me would have been a cake walk

For you perhaps it would be. However, this wasn't a torture designed to affect you was it? This treatment was designed to humiliate people who have very strict views on sexual practices.

The rules state that we can use mental duress to get information but can cause no bodily harm, this means we can use mind games to get info, but cannot bodily harm these people

I take it you either did not read all of the reports from Abu Graib or selectively ignored those that undermine your argument. To recap, the deaths of several detainees, sexual assault of women and teenage girls doesn't count as bodily harm? These are amongst some of the more severe allegations to emerge from the debacle.

Maybe we should walk up to these prisoners of war and say here have a cup of tea and tell me where your army is at waiting to attack us.

Are you sure they are Prisoners of War? Would you like to change that to another category to dig yourself out of a hole you just fell into?

America has neatly circumvented the Geneva Convention regulations by inventing a new category of detainee, the "Illegal Combatant", not defined as a genuine POW and hence not even entitled to the protections of the Geneva Convention. Good old camp delta (or whatever the hell you call it these days) is the prime example.

To the people that this happened with I am sorry this is war, thats how I had to take it, the only difference is that you had the Genevia convention to protect you, I on the other hand wasn't so lucky this country didn't believe in the convention.

Well, this is the point, isn't it? As America is signatory to the Geneva Convention (AFAIK) which gives instruction on the treatment of POWs. Even the small amount of material released on Abu Graib for public consumption contains clear breaches of the convention.

So, tell me, how much does America really believe in the Convention? Or is it just lip service?

[KennyR]

FluffyMcDeath wrote:
On a slightly related note....

Travel, kill people, and knock up your fellow soldiers in the Army

:lol:

These squarehead godfearing military types and their 50s morality...they usually turn out to be bigger sluts than the hippies!

I wonder who the father of England's baby was - a person or a regiment. :)

[Glaucus]

These squarehead godfearing military types and their 50s morality...they usually turn out to be bigger sluts than the hippies!heh, well, we all know that no one is actually judged by their actions, but by the image they portray! ;-)

@smerf,

You need to get yourself laid!! I recommend Berlin's Kit Kat Club (http://www.kitkatclub.de/). If that doesn't fix you up, you're beyond hope! :-P

- Mike

[Karlos]

Glaucus wrote:

@smerf,

I recommend Berlin's Kit Kat Club (http://www.kitkatclub.de/). If that doesn't fix you up, you're beyond hope! :-P

- Mike

Kit Kat Club? And there was me thinking it would be a nice bit of "take a break" two fingered chocolatey fun ;-)

I guess there could be fingers involved but that's as far as it goes :lol: