Hey America, you've been robbed.

[FluffyMcDeath]

but you probably already knew that. looks like someone threw a Greenspanner in the works. Follow along with this little tale.

Social Security (http://www.jimhightower.com/air/read.asp?id=11354)

So look forward to that little pension helper job at McDonalds.

[Tigger]

FluffyMcDeath wrote:
but you probably already knew that. looks like someone threw a Greenspanner in the works. Follow along with this little tale.

Social Security (http://www.jimhightower.com/air/read.asp?id=11354)

So look forward to that little pension helper job at McDonalds.

Yes we all know it, its been discussed for years, of course Jims version of it is completely inaccurate, and shows little to no knowledge of how the US government or Social Security work, but its "Canadian" accurate so you should quote from it alot.
-Tig

[KennyR]

Thatcher did the same to us.

[Fade]

@ FluffyMcDeath
"Hey America, you've been robbed."
-----------------

Hey Fluffy, you nailed it, but in a different way than you meant.

Baby boomers have known for years that their numbers will break Social Security and the smart ones have prepared for their future retirement. I do feel sorry for the ones that have believed the Democratic rhetoric for the last 60 years about it being a self sustaining program.

Any child with a pencil, paper and fourth grade education could figure it out. If a person draws out within 5 years after retirement, every dollar that he has put into a retirement fund during his whole working career, how long can it last? My grandfather retired at age 65, and lived to be 101 years old, so in his case he used up his own and 6 more people's retirement.

The only thing that has kept this socialist program going, is the percentage of people paying in, have been able to pay for the ones on retirement. When it started, 1 retiree was being supported by almost 20 workers paying into the fund. Over the years that ratio has changed to where it is less than 2 workers for each retiree, plus the fund is now also paying out to people who have never contributed into the system, such as spouses that never worked, children of deceased workers, etc. etc.

Cold hard facts are hard to swallow, but there they are, and anyone gullible enough to believe the Democratic lies about saving Social Security, do so at their own peril.

The really sad cases, are the socialist countries that have based their whole system around this type of pie in the sky future. If you don't believe me, get the figures for your own country, and do the math.

In the US, the Democrats can take full credit for starting the program and propagating the belief that this type of retirement is sustainable, and they should be prosecuted for deceiving the gullible into this same belief.

But as Mr. T used to say; "Pity the Fool."

[KennyR]

@Fade

So you'd rather entrust your future to the fickle mercies of the free market? What happens if there is a market downturn and the money you've been saving half your life from hard work and sweat just 'disappears'?

[ltstanfo]

It's called portfolio diversification Kenny. You have a valid point if you put all of your investments into a single fund (ie Enron employees, etc..) or just a few funds. Besides, anyone who invests in the market is aware that values / rates change daily. That is why you are investing for many years (decades), not just a year or two.

Regards,
ltstanfo

[Glaucus]

ltstanfo wrote:
It's called portfolio diversification Kenny. You have a valid point if you put all of your investments into a single fund (ie Enron employees, etc..) or just a few funds. Besides, anyone who invests in the market is aware that values / rates change daily. That is why you are investing for many years (decades), not just a year or two.

Regards,
ltstanfoKenny still raises a valid point. Most people are not financial gurus, and in fact, quite the opposite. That's why we have things like mutual funds and financial companies. Of course all this really means is that we must then place trust in others once again to ensure our retirement funds.

And for the record, diversifying doesn't mean you're safe either. I diversified and all it did was lessen the loss when the markets tanked a few years ago. Yes, if you put all your eggs into the Enron basket you'd have gotten nothing, but when something the size of Enron goes down everyone feels it to some extent. The idea of the pension is that it's secure from all this. Unfortunately, the way it's implemented in the US (and possibly in Canada as well) makes it equally insecure. Here in Canada it's been common knowledge that by the time my generation hits retirement age there might not even be a pension plan.

- Mike

[ltstanfo]

Glaucus wrote:
Kenny still raises a valid point. Most people are not financial gurus, and in fact, quite the opposite. That's why we have things like mutual funds and financial companies. Of course all this really means is that we must then place trust in others once again to ensure our retirement funds.

And for the record, diversifying doesn't mean you're safe either. I diversified and all it did was lessen the loss when the markets tanked a few years ago. Yes, if you put all your eggs into the Enron basket you'd have gotten nothing, but when something the size of Enron goes down everyone feels it to some extent. The idea of the pension is that it's secure from all this. Unfortunately, the way it's implemented in the US (and possibly in Canada as well) makes it equally insecure. Here in Canada it's been common knowledge that by the time my generation hits retirement age there might not even be a pension plan.

- Mike

You bring up valid points but as I referenced in my previous posting, investing in the market is a long haul situation. You expect to be in it years or even decades. Yes, money will be lost. I certainly lost money in the last few years but now my investments are rebounding quite nicely. Like you, we here in the states have been warned for years that there might not be a social security system when I retire (I am 38) or my generation may be the last to receive benifits from it. That is why I am not planning on it being my security blanket for retirement.

Just as an FYI, most Americans do not regard Social Security as a pension per say. I know it is a matter of symantics (sp?) but most people here regard a pension as a work related benifit plan and social security as a "safety net" for those who don't have / didn't have the opportunity to participate in a pension plan.

Regards,
ltstanfo