Wow! C-USA's first commercial.

[Iggy]

As posted earlier by Redrumloa:

http://www.commodore-amiga.org/forum/27-commodore-usa/2289-commodore-c64x-launches-april-5th-2011-at-midnight-eastern-usa?lang=en#2305

pretty cool!

[Argo]

Any clue to when they will be selling product and not hype?

[redrumloa]

Any clue to when they will be selling product and not hype?

http://www.commodoreusa.net/CUSA_Store.aspx

[Iggy]

Any clue to when they will be selling product and not hype?

According to everyone, supposedly tomorrow. But I'll only believe that when someone offers to take money in exchanges for one. And I'm not going to be first in line (my next buy is going to be a Powerbook for future MorphOS use).

Edit - Uh, is it after midnight? Thanks Red. I guess now.

[Plaz]

C64 commercial in 2011... cool. Spliced graphics with Tron takes.... mmm, kinda weak for me.

Plaz

[redrumloa]

C64 commercial in 2011... cool. Spliced graphics with Tron takes.... mmm, kinda weak for me.

Plaz

It took me a few watches, it's not bad. I like it better than some of the commercials I saw previously.

[Argo]

So, not available and costs as much as my computer but does less. Granted most of that cost is the short run to make the cases. The page doesn't even list what the specs are. CPU speed, ports, etc.

I should have said ship product.

[Plaz]

Price is about what the original premeired for. Nice touch.

Plaz

[redrumloa]

So, not available and cost as much as my computer but does less. Granted most of that cost is the short run to make the cases. The page doesn't even list what the specs are. CPU speed, ports, etc.

The specs are on the main product page...

[Franko]

Gawd... I could have done better on me poxy old iMac, still I've ripped it off of you tube now and going to have some fun with it... :D

Anyone notice the fact that the Disney name and copyright only flashes up for a split second and that on YouTube itself you can only access it if you have a direct link... wonder why that is... hmmm... ;)

[Argo]

The specs are on the main product page...

That site need a major overhaul pronto.

[redrumloa]

That site need a major overhaul pronto.

Agreed.

[dammy]

Agreed.

+1

[Argo]

Someone need to show their webmaster a real ecommerce and business showcase site.

Really, they would come off better and do better if they would just slow down and do it right one step at a time.

[redrumloa]

Someone need to show their webmaster a real ecommerce and business showcase site.

Really, they would come off better and do better if they would just slow down and do it right one step at a time.

Agreed, Barry should have picked a CMS solution.

[number6]

Agreed.


Also agreed.
I realize there is a pull down menu, but if you go by lowest common denominator tuning into the page...
You see the item and then natural inclination is to click on it for info. Nada. Could use a few links added, imo.

#6

[Darrin]

That site need a major overhaul pronto.

He's waiting until HP updates their website and then he'll copy that.

[Darrin]

Right, I wantched it and...

err...

umm...

yes.

I still think it needs more function keys.

[Iggy]

Right, I wantched it and...

err...

umm...

yes.

I still think it needs more function keys.

I thought about it and then...

595 DOLLARS, OMFG, NO WAY!

I can get an Intel Atom system for half that.

Which means its a $300 case?

[Franko]

I see now that commercial has been released the other thread here "CommodoreUSA Partners with Disney" has now been closed... ;)

Kinda makes you wonder if Barry had this planned all along to drum up interest in his new commercial... ;)

So does that mean this thread will get closed when they release something else, call me suspicious but something don't smell right round here and it's not just that commercial or me feet... :)

[Iggy]

I see now that commercial has been released the other thread here "CommodoreUSA Partners with Disney" has now been closed... ;)

Kinda makes you wonder if Barry had this planned all along to drum up interest in his new commercial... ;)

So does that mean this thread will get closed when they release something else, call me suspicious but something don't smell right round here and it's not just that commercial or me feet... :)

See my signature. You're ALL in on it (and Redrumloa eats puppies, he even said so).

[dammy]

I thought about it and then...

595 DOLLARS, OMFG, NO WAY!

I can get an Intel Atom system for half that.

Which means its a $300 case?

If you look, you can buy the case, keyboard, and card reader for $250. That custom keyboard is VERY expensive even at a OEM cost.

[Darrin]

I thought about it and then...

595 DOLLARS, OMFG, NO WAY!

I can get an Intel Atom system for half that.

Which means its a $300 case?

Damn, I didn't check the price!

For $595 I expect something like:

http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=7186287&CatId=4928

Acer AM3910-U4012 Desktop PC - Intel Core i3-550 3.2GHz, 6GB DDR3, 1TB HDD, DVDRW, Windows 7 Home Premium 64-bit

Mind you, we won't get Windows 7 but free Linux and a pirate copy of Amiga Forever along with VICE.

[Iggy]

If you look, you can buy the case, keyboard, and card reader for $250. That custom keyboard is VERY expensive even at a OEM cost.

I remember contracting for similar keyboards when I worked for a small outfit that built PCs. They were well under $100.

I think I'll gut a non-functional A500, A600, or A1200 and use a keyboard converter. It would be cheaper.

[Darrin]

If you look, you can buy the case, keyboard, and card reader for $250. That custom keyboard is VERY expensive even at a OEM cost.

Bloody hell! Give me a real non-functioning C64 for $10 off eBay, a $10 keyboard from Walmart and 30 minutes with my Dremel...

[Franko]

-=Moderated=-

[Darrin]

I remember contracting for similar keyboards when I worked for a small outfit that built PCs. They were well under $100.

I think I'll gut a non-functional A500, A600, or A1200 and use a keyboard converter. It would be cheaper.

The real test will be to see what The Daddy sells his FPGA Arcade A500+ type cases (including keyboard) for. Considering he;s producing them in small quantities more or less by hand, if he can sell them for under $250 then we know we're being told porkies.

My guess is that there is a small factory in China making them for $10 each, add $2 for shipping and $20 for importation duties and... KaChing!

[dammy]

I remember contracting for similar keyboards when I worked for a small outfit that built PCs. They were well under $100.

It is below $100, but not by very much.

I think I'll gut a non-functional A500, A600, or A1200 and use a keyboard converter. It would be cheaper.

Or wait for Yoz's design to go into production. But again, this is for the C64 folks, this is not a Commodore Amiga, that's further down the road.

[Franko]

I remember contracting for similar keyboards when I worked for a small outfit that built PCs. They were well under $100.

I think I'll gut a non-functional A500, A600, or A1200 and use a keyboard converter. It would be cheaper.

Was wondering when all you folk who were so fascinated with buying one of these cases would realise that for 30 years now you could buy the original case at a fraction of their prices and have the real thing to do with as you please... :lol:

[Iggy]

-=Moderated=-

[Franko]

-=Moderated=-

[Iggy]

But again, this is for the C64 folks, this is not a Commodore Amiga, that's further down the road.

I'm not sitting at either one of these poles (positive or negative), but the Commodore and Amiga names aren't important to me (that's why I'm using the OS I am).
I'll let you and Franko argue out the import of new "Amigas".

[dammy]

I'm not sitting at either one of these poles (positive or negative), but the Commodore and Amiga names aren't important to me (that's why I'm using the OS I am).
I'll let you and Franko argue out the import of new "Amigas".

I'm waiting to see what the OS turns out to be for the new Commodore Amigas.

[Franko]

Anyone notice that in a 30 second commercial the Commodore logo and the C64 only take up 10 seconds of it, the rest is advertising for a Disney product, methinks Disney's just shafted CUSA in that deal... :lol:

[Darrin]

-=Moderated=-

[Franko]

-=Moderated=-

[Darrin]

-=Moderated=-

[Franko]

-=Moderated=-

[haywirepc]

Now taking pre-orders, wow pre-orders! Now they really are like amiga inc!

Commodore os will be shipped to you when available. This all sounds vaguely familiar. Someone said something about amithlon being developed.
If they did Aros or amithlon, I'm interested, otherwise ubuntu with an amiga wallpaper is of no interest to me or most amigans.

The vic and the vic slim are existing products with commodore stickers slapped on them and ubuntu installed. It must have taken them literally minutes of development time on those.

On the c64 I think its a nice novelty, but not worth the money. At least that one took them time to develop. The specs are really unimpressive though. I can buy a similar computer for so much less, but It IS a novelty, so I suppose your paying for the novelty of it.

I suppose I can see why someone who is a huge c64 fan would want one, so I wish them the best with selling them. Still, I don't believe these will ever make it to actual retail stores, but I'd be interested in knowing exactly how many of them they sell and in what markets.

The ad while interesting, makes me wonder if they actually obtained permission to use scenes from the movie in their commercial, or if they just put their ad in the dvd hoping they could use that footage without actually paying for its use.

If they didn't pay for its use, its quite a copyright violation using movie footage to peddle their own wares. Its also quite misleading, because their computers had nothing to do with that movie except to buy an ad in the dvd release.

Steven

[Franko]

The ad while interesting, makes me wonder if they actually obtained permission to use scenes from the movie in their commercial, or if they just put their ad in the dvd hoping they could use that footage without actually paying for its use.

If they didn't pay for its use, its quite a copyright violation using movie footage to peddle their own wares. Its also quite misleading, because their computers had nothing to do with that movie except to buy an ad in the dvd release.

Steven

Well I've sent Disney Studios a link to the video on YouTube and I have it downloaded here in case it gets removed, so hopefully I'll get some sort of response from them to prove whether this is all ligit or not... :)

[Darrin]

Now taking pre-orders, wow pre-orders! Now they really are like amiga inc!

"Pre-order", a word that now strikes fear into every Amiga user! :eek:

Commodore os will be shipped to you when available. This all sounds vaguely familiar. Someone said something about amithlon being developed. If they did Aros or amithlon, I'm interested, otherwise ubuntu with an amiga wallpaper is of no interest to me or most amigans.

When available? Since when was Linux unavailable?

The vic and the vic slim are existing products with commodore stickers slapped on them and ubuntu installed. It must have taken them literally minutes of development time on those.

See Franko's "Aussie Kitching Assembly Line" video. :D

On the c64 I think its a nice novelty, but not worth the money. At least that one took them time to develop. The specs are really unimpressive though. I can buy a similar computer for so much less, but It IS a novelty, so I suppose your paying for the novelty of it.

Don't forget that you'll also become Vice President, Marketing Manager, Distribution Manager, etc for every unit you buy.

The ad while interesting, makes me wonder if they actually obtained permission to use scenes from the movie in their commercial, or if they just put their ad in the dvd hoping they could use that footage without actually paying for its use.

I don't think that even they could be that stupid. Mind you... ;)

[Duce]

Pricey, as expected. And no Amiga products in store yet, so I'll keep my comments to myself. But good on them. To give credit where credit is due, they did their "ad campaign". If it cost them 30 million or whatever insane figure they were spouting, I don't see where it went, but I'm sure they have further plans for the aforementioned ad budget. As usual, still confused why this C-USA stuff seems to be so heavily promoted when projects like the FPGA board which has the community absolutely ecstatic had far fewer "big names" pounding the pulpit for it. Where's the love for the little guys like Natami and the FPGA Arcade guys, who are working their stones off to bring us Amigans a reliable and more modern "Amiga". Saddening, really - even if the C-USA offerings are not up my alley. Then again, I've always rooted for the grassroots guys out there that have soldering irons and compilers in hand, so I must be missing something.

[redrumloa]

Now taking pre-orders, wow pre-orders! Now they really are like amiga inc!


Valid criticism.

On the c64 I think its a nice novelty, but not worth the money. At least that one took them time to develop. The specs are really unimpressive though. I can buy a similar computer for so much less, but It IS a novelty, so I suppose your paying for the novelty of it.


I am still interested in the case and keyboard without guts, which is not for sale yet. .


The ad while interesting, makes me wonder if they actually obtained permission to use scenes from the movie in their commercial, or if they just put their ad in the dvd hoping they could use that footage without actually paying for its use.

If they didn't pay for its use, its quite a copyright violation using movie footage to peddle their own wares. Its also quite misleading, because their computers had nothing to do with that movie except to buy an ad in the dvd release.

You can bet your bottom dollar that CUSA was vetted and if they used Disney's IP without permission Disney will make sure the Sword of Damocles (no relation to Dammy) will fall down on CUSA.

[haywirepc]

"I've always rooted for the grassroots guys out there that have soldering irons and compilers in hand, so I must be missing something. "

I agree. Which is probably why cusa irks alot of people. Its like they want the most attention for doing the least they could possibly do.

I forgot about the reported 30 million dollar advertising campaign. Of course, that was supposed to be for commercials that were suppose to be aired last christmas. Perhaps their new budget for this quarter is closer to 300 bucks? (300$ = Pay a video editor to splice together stolen movie footage with your logo, then only put it on youtube till it gets yanked for copyright violation)

They could always call it a fan video, but considering they are a "company" selling something, I don't think it qualifies.

It will be interesting to hear where this will be broadcast? If just youtube, well I'm so not impressed, and I doubt anyone else is.

Steven

[ChrisUnionNJ]

Any clue to when they will be selling product and not hype?


The store is open today for preOrders and the changed some of the unit names..

And I hope he's not thinking of pulling a Jack Tramiel PET Job..lol

[Darrin]

Still, if you can't wait for C=USA to sell you one of those nice VIC models, then why not buy them from someone else:
http://www.cybernetman.com/en/all-in-one-pc/Keyboard-pc

Mind you, you won't get the C= sticker...

[SysAdmin]

Lines have already started forming to buy the C64x.

http://cbsmiami.files.wordpress.com/2011/03/ipad-line-best-buy.jpg?w=420

[Franko]

Lines have already started forming to buy the C64x.

http://cbsmiami.files.wordpress.com/2011/03/ipad-line-best-buy.jpg?w=420

I thought in the USA there was NO PARKING IN THE YELLOW ZONE... :)

[Franko]

Is this the CUSA advert aimed at the South American & Hispanic Market... (looks like they did the GFX on the new C64x)... :D

fe4lVzgFVWc&feature=related

[Duce]

LOL nice Best Buy pic: ipad-line-best-buy.jpg

[dentunes]

Delivery between mid May and early April.


ROFLMAO!!!! We are going back in time!

[cicero790]

Thanks for posting. Nice commercial, it is now written into history. I think all this is fun. I'm also curious about more info on the tablet. Have been thinking of getting one.

[Amiga_Nut]

.......pirate copy of Amiga Forever.....

I'm sold :roflmao:

(or do you mean illegal KS ROMs and loads of ADFs....deal breaker!!)

[kolla]

That custom keyboard is VERY expensive even at a OEM cost.
Which makes it even more sad that it is made totally WRONG!
(sigh)

[Kesa]

See Franko's "Aussie Kitching Assembly Line" video. :D





:confused:

[Franko]

Just noticed I'd received this reply from Disney about a question I sent to them earlier regarding the content of this CUSA commercial... make of it what you will... :)

from Disney Online Support UK <help@disney.co.uk>
to Frank Spiers <************@***.com>
date 5 April 2011 08:47
subject Re: Tron Legacy Footage Used On YouTube Video...
mailed-by disney.co.uk

hide details 08:47 (3 hours ago)

Dear Frank Spiers,
Thank you for your e-mail.
We want you to know that we very much appreciate the time you took to bring this matter to our attention. We protect our intellectual property rights vigorously and we take reports of suspected infringements very seriously. However, as you can appreciate, our investigations are confidential. We neither reveal our sources nor do we generally correspond further with them about the investigation.
Please feel free to use our email address, tips@disneyantipiracy.com, if you want to provide more information about the suspected infringement or to report a suspected infringement in the future.
Sincerely,
Charles
Disney Online UK

[crawff]

-=Moderated=-

[Kesa]

Just noticed I'd received this reply from Disney about a question I sent to them earlier regarding the content of this CUSA commercial... make of it what you will... :)

from Disney Online Support UK <help@disney.co.uk>
to Frank Spiers <************@***.com>
date 5 April 2011 08:47
subject Re: Tron Legacy Footage Used On YouTube Video...
mailed-by disney.co.uk

hide details 08:47 (3 hours ago)

Dear Frank Spiers,
Thank you for your e-mail.
We want you to know that we very much appreciate the time you took to bring this matter to our attention. We protect our intellectual property rights vigorously and we take reports of suspected infringements very seriously. However, as you can appreciate, our investigations are confidential. We neither reveal our sources nor do we generally correspond further with them about the investigation.
Please feel free to use our email address, tips@disneyantipiracy.com, if you want to provide more information about the suspected infringement or to report a suspected infringement in the future.
Sincerely,
Charles
Disney Online UK

Oh c'mon that's fake! You even took off your email address. Nice try Franko :roflmao:

[persia]

600 bucks for a netbook minus the screen in a retro case. I can't contain my excitement, somebody help me.]

http://fc08.deviantart.net/fs31/f/2008/232/b/0/Ash_Facepalm_Sprite_Animation_by_PhantomofAsh.gifh ttp://fc08.deviantart.net/fs31/f/2008/232/b/0/Ash_Facepalm_Sprite_Animation_by_PhantomofAsh.gifh ttp://fc08.deviantart.net/fs31/f/2008/232/b/0/Ash_Facepalm_Sprite_Animation_by_PhantomofAsh.gifh ttp://fc08.deviantart.net/fs31/f/2008/232/b/0/Ash_Facepalm_Sprite_Animation_by_PhantomofAsh.gifh ttp://fc08.deviantart.net/fs31/f/2008/232/b/0/Ash_Facepalm_Sprite_Animation_by_PhantomofAsh.gif

[Franko]

Oh c'mon that's fake! You even took off your email address. Nice try Franko :roflmao:

If you want I'll forward it to you I've no other way to prove it's genuine or you could send an email to Disney themselves at the address in the email and I'm pretty sure you'll get the same reply... :)

Or if there is another way I can prove it's genuine then let me know and I'll be more than happy to prove it to your satisfaction... :)

Only reason I took out my own email address is because that one is a private email that I only use for things like the above... :)

PS: Kesa I'd have thought you'd have known me better by now that when I say I'm going to do something I do it, or I have sent or received email from or to someone that it's 100% genuine never had the need to lie and never will... :)

[JJ]

Surely as they have partnered with Disney on the tron thingy then they have permission.

Glad to see though that Franko (Read your email in a quote) is happy to ge mental about Amiga Inc and thinks its fine to pirate their IP but as then tries to get CUSA in the poo becasue he is on some crazy man one vendetta against them.

Dont bother replying To me franko your still on my ignore list.

[amiga92570]

Damn, I didn't check the price!

For $595 I expect something like:

http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=7186287&CatId=4928

Acer AM3910-U4012 Desktop PC - Intel Core i3-550 3.2GHz, 6GB DDR3, 1TB HDD, DVDRW, Windows 7 Home Premium 64-bit

Mind you, we won't get Windows 7 but free Linux and a pirate copy of Amiga Forever along with VICE.


Just buy the bare bones, and install your own board. Then you can have a core i3, i5, or i7. Thats what I will do, as I like the case.

[amiga92570]

Was wondering when all you folk who were so fascinated with buying one of these cases would realise that for 30 years now you could buy the original case at a fraction of their prices and have the real thing to do with as you please... :lol:

Franko, if you do not want one I say do it yourself. I have plenty of c64 cases and I have tried to mount other things inside. The old cases are mostly faded, brittle. Although I have seen some useful and creative mods using old cases, it still will look crappy compared to a new case designed to mount Mini itx board. The keyboard is nice also. Mine will have a core i5 and windows 7. Doesn't that really make you want to cry.

[jorkany]

Just noticed I'd received this reply from Disney about a question I sent to them earlier regarding the content of this CUSA commercial... make of it what you will... :)

from Disney Online Support UK <help@disney.co.uk>
to Frank Spiers <************@***.com>
date 5 April 2011 08:47
subject Re: Tron Legacy Footage Used On YouTube Video...
mailed-by disney.co.uk

hide details 08:47 (3 hours ago)

Dear Frank Spiers,
Thank you for your e-mail.
We want you to know that we very much appreciate the time you took to bring this matter to our attention. We protect our intellectual property rights vigorously and we take reports of suspected infringements very seriously. However, as you can appreciate, our investigations are confidential. We neither reveal our sources nor do we generally correspond further with them about the investigation.
Please feel free to use our email address, tips@disneyantipiracy.com, if you want to provide more information about the suspected infringement or to report a suspected infringement in the future.
Sincerely,
Charles
Disney Online UK

Interesting. So Franko, at what point do you decide to defend some company's IP rather than distribute it?

[Franko]

Franko, if you do not want one I say do it yourself. I have plenty of c64 cases and I have tried to mount other things inside. The old cases are mostly faded, brittle. Although I have seen some useful and creative mods using old cases, it still will look crappy compared to a new case designed to mount Mini itx board. The keyboard is nice also. Mine will have a core i5 and windows 7. Doesn't that really make you want to cry.

Got plenty of REAL C64's myself but none of them are faded or brittle... :)

Yup... putting any crap inside one that runs windows would make any true C64 fan cry and should be punishable by a long slow drawn out death... ;)

[JJ]

I just said that

[Franko]

Interesting. So Franko, at what point do you decide to defend some company's IP rather than distribute it?

Only when I feel like it... :D

[Colin_Camper]

http://www.commodoreusa.net/CUSA_Store.aspx

Vic slim looks the best and is pretty good value. I bought a small dell which gets hot and sounds like a 707 taking off from ebay for the missus - the Vic slim looks (and probably sounds) much nicer! Dual Atom is probably better user experience than single (albiet fast) celeron.

I might get one anyway and resell the optiplex!

[amoskodare]

595 DOLLARS??! :shocked:

Hesus facking Christ!!

:roflmao:

[mongo]

Vic slim looks the best and is pretty good value. I bought a small dell which gets hot and sounds like a 707 taking off from ebay for the missus - the Vic slim looks (and probably sounds) much nicer! Dual Atom is probably better user experience than single (albiet fast) celeron.

I might get one anyway and resell the optiplex!

This is the Vic slim http://www.seewortech.com/product_info.php?products_id=23

Apparently they sell for about $225.

[tone007]

595 DOLLARS??!

A bargain price for a computer you probably shouldn't use for extended periods due to horrible ergonomics!

For that price, they should include a matching 3" high wrist rest.

[persia]

But you have to consider that i's a netbook minus the screen....

http://www.animationforum.net/forum/images/smilies/Face_Palm_by_Mirz123.gifhttp://testyourmight.com/forum/images/smilies/facepalm.gif
595 DOLLARS??! :shocked:

Hesus facking Christ!!

:roflmao:

[espskog]

As posted earlier by Redrumloa:

http://www.commodore-amiga.org/forum/27-commodore-usa/2289-commodore-c64x-launches-april-5th-2011-at-midnight-eastern-usa?lang=en#2305

pretty cool!

That commercial is one of the most stupid things I have seen this whole year :hammer:

"Better sound, better graphics" ...what the f#¤%. Talk about comparing apples and oranges. This one simply just takes the cake :-)

[espskog]

This is the Vic slim http://www.seewortech.com/product_info.php?products_id=23

Apparently they sell for about $225.

Wow...another piece of crap HW. Isn't this nice :)

[mongo]

But you have to consider that i's a netbook minus the screen....

http://www.animationforum.net/forum/images/smilies/Face_Palm_by_Mirz123.gifhttp://testyourmight.com/forum/images/smilies/facepalm.gif

Yes. It's a netbook without the battery or the cumbersome screen.

Just what the computer world has been waiting for.

[dammy]

595 DOLLARS??! :shocked:

Hesus facking Christ!!

:roflmao:

First of all, this is targeting the C64 retro crowd and not the Amiga community. Second, that custom designed keyboard is close to $100 at OEM costs, so MSRP going to be a bit high and the pricing has to high enough for retail chains to make a profit on it as well as C=USA. Third, the pricing in EUROs is 420. Fourth, how much did you spend for that G2 based SAM440?

[amoskodare]

First of all, this is targeting the C64 retro crowd and not the Amiga community. Second, that custom designed keyboard is close to $100 at OEM costs, so MSRP going to be a bit high and the pricing has to high enough for retail chains to make a profit on it as well as C=USA. Third, the pricing in EUROs is 420. Fourth, how much did you spend for that G2 based SAM440?
My Sam440ep-flex runs OS4, the CUSA-box doesn't, so it's "kind of irrelevant" - different "platforms".

But ok, just considering the case, it could be something for the C64 retro crowd...

[number6]

@Franko

iirc, you linked in another thread that you were off to watch WrestleMania.
I was just checking today's news links about the topic at hand and found something related:

"Sheamus: When I was young, I had a Commodore 64 and then an Amiga, so I started on that."

Q&A: Pro wrestler Sheamus on video games, WWE (http://content.usatoday.com/communities/gamehunters/post/2011/04/q38a-pro-wrestler-sheamus-on-video-games-wwe/1)

#6

[mpiva]

I just watched the commercial. I can just see people saying, "COOL! I can buy the Tron DVD Combo pack that comes with a free C64. Neat!" :biglaugh:

[Franko]

@Franko

iirc, you linked in another thread that you were off to watch WrestleMania.
I was just checking today's news links about the topic at hand and found something related:

"Sheamus: When I was young, I had a Commodore 64 and then an Amiga, so I started on that."

Q&A: Pro wrestler Sheamus on video games, WWE (http://content.usatoday.com/communities/gamehunters/post/2011/04/q38a-pro-wrestler-sheamus-on-video-games-wwe/1)

#6

With hands the size Sheamus has got I reckon he must've went through a fair amount of Joysticks back in the day... :)

Odd thing is I wouldn't have put him down as being old enough to remember the C64... :)

Anyway the Undertaker still rulez... 19 & 0 :D

[jorkany]

With hands the size Sheamus has got I reckon he must've went through a fair amount of Joysticks back in the day... :)

Odd thing is I wouldn't have put him down as being old enough to remember the C64... :)

Anyway the Undertaker still rulez... 19 & 0 :D

19 & 0? Pffftt...come back when he can top this guy:

http://www.thepostgame.com/blog/good-sports/201103/one-legged-wrestler-wins-ncaa-title

[Franko]

19 & 0? Pffftt...come back when he can top this guy:

http://www.thepostgame.com/blog/good-sports/201103/one-legged-wrestler-wins-ncaa-title

Pfffttt... Easy Zach Gowan... :D

tyVvHEPZa0w

Try harder next time... ;)

[danwood]

First of all, this is targeting the C64 retro crowd and not the Amiga community. Second, that custom designed keyboard is close to $100 at OEM costs, so MSRP going to be a bit high and the pricing has to high enough for retail chains to make a profit on it as well as C=USA. Third, the pricing in EUROs is 420. Fourth, how much did you spend for that G2 based SAM440?

Didn't you claim a while back they're not targeting the "retro" community?

Oh and this is not comparable to a Sam440, find me a PPC similarly specced mobo for a lower price? PPC hardware is more costly than x86. Sam440 runs OS 4, C64x doesn't, that's like saying "my dell laptop is cheaper than a macbook!", they don't run the same platforms.

If CUSA sell 100 of these pieces of crap I'll be amazed.

[jorkany]

Pfffttt... Easy Zach Gowan... :D

tyVvHEPZa0w

Try harder next time... ;)

You're joking, right? I mean, I admire Gowan for doing what he does despite missing a leg, but his history is one of loss after loss and that's in a showboating arena. Meanwhile Robles is virtually undefeated. 96-0 in high school, and 36-0 in his senior year, plus winning at NCAA (real wrestling).

[Digiman]

First of all, this is targeting the C64 retro crowd and not the Amiga community. Second, that custom designed keyboard is close to $100 at OEM costs, so MSRP going to be a bit high and the pricing has to high enough for retail chains to make a profit on it as well as C=USA. Third, the pricing in EUROs is 420. Fourth, how much did you spend for that G2 based SAM440?

1. Why is it being pimped on this Amiga forum then? You admit now it has FA to do with Amiga now hmmmm thanks.

2. €65+€65 ie 100% profit for fake C= and retailer is at the top end ofhardware sales (20-50% = normal). So £99-109 is more than enough for just a case for the greedy tits. And the crap motherboard specs worth about £50-75 AT BEST.
So you have proved to us it is a rip-off markup on a fancy desktop case + under powered limp wristed x86 Windows/Liux motherboard. Thanks :)

3. I bought a mint actual C64 + uIEC/MMC + SD card for less than 1/3 your C64x list price....hell I even got the Retrogenius Ultimate C64 DVD with REAL tape images....and I never have to look at crap like x86 Windows before VICE is loads and I'm playing ORIGINAL UNCRACKED GAMES :roflmao:

[Digiman]

If CUSA sell 100 of these pieces of crap I'll be amazed.

World is full of stupid people :)

[Karlos]

1. Why is it being pimped on this Amiga forum then? You admit now it has FA to do with Amiga now hmmmm thanks.

I don't think that was ever in doubt, which is why it is posted in the "other operating systems" section of the forum.

[dammy]

Didn't you claim a while back they're not targeting the "retro" community?

For which product? C64x has always been about the retro crowd.

Oh and this is not comparable to a Sam440, find me a PPC similarly specced mobo for a lower price? PPC hardware is more costly than x86.

Yes it is relevant actually. This is about a hobby computer and what people will pay for it. I can't see too many people buying this as their one and only computer. Some will, most will not. It breaks down to what people are willing to spend, be it on a SAM440, A1X1K, EFIKA-MX or a C64x. Reason they are spending money on is they want a specific entertainment value out of it. Those who spend far greater amounts for a computer with far lesser hardware capabilities have no place to complain about the current prices.

Sam440 runs OS 4, C64x doesn't, that's like saying "my dell laptop is cheaper than a macbook!", they don't run the same platforms.

If CUSA sell 100 of these pieces of crap I'll be amazed.

I find it interesting a OS4 supporter(s) condemning it which has yet to have it's first review. In any regard, be prepared to be amazed, a big box retail chain here in the US already order 20 units @ store an there is over 1,000 stores. Do the math. :)

[eliyahu]

This is about a hobby computer and what people will pay for it. I can't see too many people buying this as their one and only computer. Some will, most will not. It breaks down to what people are willing to spend, be it on a SAM440, A1X1K, EFIKA-MX or a C64x. Reason they are spending money on is they want a specific entertainment value out of it.
there are quite a few folks that are gonna remember that quote later this year, you know. :)

-- eliyahu

[runequester]

So they have gotten to shipping actual product? Good on them. They turned out to be a legitimate business.

Now to see consumer reviews come in, and see what the verdict is.


And I assume this then silences the whole "OS4 hardware is too expensive" stuff for good then.

[dammy]

1. Why is it being pimped on this Amiga forum then? You admit now it has FA to do with Amiga now hmmmm thanks.

Check out what subboard it was posted on.

2. €65+€65 ie 100% profit for fake C= and retailer is at the top end ofhardware sales (20-50% = normal). So £99-109 is more than enough for just a case for the greedy tits. And the crap motherboard specs worth about £50-75 AT BEST.
So you have proved to us it is a rip-off markup on a fancy desktop case + under powered limp wristed x86 Windows/Liux motherboard. Thanks :)

First, convert it to USD, that may help you with the math. Go take a look at those components, C=USA didn't go low quality on them so the price is higher. Add in the cost of the case and that very expensive custom keyboard, labor to assemble them all, pay shipping to and from, pay tech support, and then there is the Disney Tron Legacy DVD. Adds up pretty quick.

3. I bought a mint actual C64 + uIEC/MMC + SD card for less than 1/3 your C64x list price....hell I even got the Retrogenius Ultimate C64 DVD with REAL tape images....and I never have to look at crap like x86 Windows before VICE is loads and I'm playing ORIGINAL UNCRACKED GAMES :roflmao:

Well good for you.

[dammy]

there are quite a few folks that are gonna remember that quote later this year, you know. :)

-- eliyahu

Their money, their choice in the matter. Wealthy spends all types of insane amount of money on something, more power to them. Someone gets what they desire and someone makes a profit. I just find it awfully interesting that some of the people who are complaining about the price of the C64x don't have issue spending multiple times that on their own hobby computer which does far less and has far less support.

[SysAdmin]

I only have one question, will it blend?

http://www.google.com/search?client=safari&rls=en&q=dopes+it+blrnd&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8#q=does+it+blend&hl=en&client=safari&sa=X&rls=en&prmd=ivns&source=univ&tbm=vid&tbo=u&ei=4l6bTZb2Jo-6sQPtjJGJBA&ved=0CD4QqwQ&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.&fp=958a97d153ccd67c


:)

[dammy]

So they have gotten to shipping actual product? Good on them. They turned out to be a legitimate business.

Not yet, online orders will be completed either later this month or by mid May of 2011. Big box retailer probably has first priority.

Now to see consumer reviews come in, and see what the verdict is.

It will be interesting to see if C=USA did it right or has to change things.


And I assume this then silences the whole "OS4 hardware is too expensive" stuff for good then.

OS4 hardware coming down in price to match C=USA's Amigas? Wonderful news! Consumer always wins out when there is real competition. You have a link for us on this price change? Dual core pricing for Dual core pricing, right?

[Franko]

I'm just glad that this whole CUSA issue will be decided one way or the other very shortly and then folks can decide for themselves whether it's good or bad for the site if CUSA stuff stays or goes... :)

[digitex]

1. Why is it being pimped on this Amiga forum then? You admit now it has FA to do with Amiga now hmmmm thanks.

2. €65+€65 ie 100% profit for fake C= and retailer is at the top end ofhardware sales (20-50% = normal). So £99-109 is more than enough for just a case for the greedy tits. And the crap motherboard specs worth about £50-75 AT BEST.
So you have proved to us it is a rip-off markup on a fancy desktop case + under powered limp wristed x86 Windows/Liux motherboard. Thanks :)

3. I bought a mint actual C64 + uIEC/MMC + SD card for less than 1/3 your C64x list price....hell I even got the Retrogenius Ultimate C64 DVD with REAL tape images....and I never have to look at crap like x86 Windows before VICE is loads and I'm playing ORIGINAL UNCRACKED GAMES :roflmao:

really??? :)
"...So £99-109 is more than enough for just a case "

BEFORE YOU OPEN YOUR MOUTH, TRY TO ENGAGE YOUR BRAIN FOR 2 SECONDS, AND THINK ABOUT WHAT THIS REALLY COSTS:

custom injection mold ABS case, that is available nowhere on this planet, a custom keyboard (like DAS), with custom dual shot injection molded spherical keys, Cheery Blue key switches, metal UL bracket for dvd & hdd, dual SATA & Power cable harness(custom), LED/Power switch combo, rubber feet, custom logo badge (not a sticker) 40mm x 10mm high velocity silent fan, 42 format card reader w/ USB port, case plates for dvd opening and card reader, screws and cable ties, full color glossy printed showcase package carton, shipping carton, labor to assemble (not little Chinese kids), 100% assembly in USA, printed insert material, incoming freight charges, ADD TO THAT AN AMORTIZED AMOUNT FOR THE COST OF DESIGN & MOLD CONSTRUCTION (ALMOST 100K US$) AND THE FCC & UL CERTIFICATIONS.

"..crap motherboard specs worth about £50-75 AT BEST."

GO PRICE OUT AN INTEL ATOM DUAL CORE 525 @ 1.8 GHZ, WITH ON BOARD DC POWER CONVERSION (CRITICAL) WITH NVIDEA ION2 GRAPHICS, WiFi/n BLUTOOTH on board or mini pcie card,EXTERNAL 90 WATT 12 Vdc universal power adaptor, incoming freight. YOU WILL NOT FIND THIS ANYWHERE, REGARDLESS OF THE MANUFACTURER, FOR LESS THAN OVER US$200+. AND THAT DOES NOT INCLUDE MEMORY!

THE ACTUAL KEYBOARD CANNOT BE BOUGHT FOR LESS THAN $135-$160, AND THAT WILL STILL NOT GIVE YOU THE CUSTOM EXACT STYLE AND SHAPE AND COLOR OF THE ORIGINAL C64, JUST UPDATED WITH MODERN FUNCTIONS.

NOW YOU KNOW WHY THIS MACHINE IS PRICED AS IT IS. BUY IT OR DON'T..JUST BE AWARE OF WHAT IT IS YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT, BEFORE YOU FORM YOUR OPINIONS AND MAKE RIDICULOUS COMMENTS.

[digitex]

I'm just glad that this whole CUSA issue will be decided one way or the other very shortly and then folks can decide for themselves whether it's good or bad for the site if CUSA stuff stays or goes... :)

Think about this....the all time record for most users -=Moderated=- on Amiga.org was 497 on July28,2010, most likley because of a CUSA event. And how many years has this forum been up???

Last night our forum was holding at between 725-800 quests/members, and the forum is only a few weeks old.

Just what does this tell you?

[eliyahu]

Their money, their choice in the matter. Wealthy spends all types of insane amount of money on something, more power to them. Someone gets what they desire and someone makes a profit. I just find it awfully interesting that some of the people who are complaining about the price of the C64x don't have issue spending multiple times that on their own hobby computer which does far less and has far less support.
agreed. i'm a (very happy) OS4 user and owner of a SAM. no one could possibly argue the price/performance ratio is anything close to modern consumer electronics. the same folks who were unhappy about people making fun of the eventual price of the A1X1K shouldn't now be whinging on about the cost of the C64x.

creating something new costs money. in most cases, for anything involving genuine engineering, rather quite a lot.

the CUSA machines -- at least the ones announced to date -- aren't my 'cup of tea,' but i'm still hoping these guys are successful. the commodore brand could use with a bit of success, you know? in the end i would imagine the C64x will vastly outsell anything produced by any of the amiga-related companies in the past decade.

not for me, and not for most of you, but if someone finds value in it, why not?

-- eliyahu

[jorkany]

Think about this....the all time record for most users (abusers) on Amiga.org was 497 on July28,2010, most likley because of a CUSA event. And how many years has this forum been up???

Last night our forum was holding at between 725-800 quests/members, and the forum is only a few weeks old.

Just what does this tell you?

Well, if I were a certain paranoid Baptist dockworker in Missouri it would tell me that the hackers are getting ready to attack en masse!

[Digiman]

Check out what subboard it was posted on.



First, convert it to USD, that may help you with the math. Go take a look at those components, C=USA didn't go low quality on them so the price is higher. Add in the cost of the case and that very expensive custom keyboard, labor to assemble them all, pay shipping to and from, pay tech support, and then there is the Disney Tron Legacy DVD. Adds up pretty quick.



Well good for you.

I gave it to you in percentages so currency doesn't matter. 100% profit is just OTT and proves it's worthless junk.

[Franko]

Think about this....the all time record for most users on Amiga.org was 497 on July28,2010, most likley because of a CUSA event. And how many years has this forum been up???

Last night our forum was holding at between 725-800 quests/members, and the forum is only a few weeks old.

Just what does this tell you?



The day you picked to make your pathetic little claim that it was down to a "CUSA event" just shows what total -=Moderated=- you really are as everybody here knows that day was down "SpamBots" attacking the site not anything to do with your -=Moderated=- company... :)

So stick that in yer pipe and smoke it ya dunderheid... :roflmao:

[eliyahu]

It tells me Barry or Leo whichever one you are that your a bigger idiot than I thought you stupid fool... :)
digitex is the online moniker for barry altman.

-- eliyahu

[redrumloa]

Last night our forum was holding at between 725-800 quests/members, and the forum is only a few weeks old.

Just what does this tell you?

I saw that, impressive! That is the Disney factor!

[digitex]

Red, actually NOT, as the Disney factor has not even kicked in yet. The DVD is only being released today. There was no advertising yet at all. This was the CUSA factor of visitors to our site, and then clicking through to the forum link. Once the PR and ads break, we expect 1000 quests/members on the forum, at least for the first few months.

[Franko]

digitex is the online moniker for barry altman.

-- eliyahu

I guessed that from his first post and called him out on it, but the big bag of keech is too chicken to admit it... :roflmao:

C'mon Barry, take me on I'm ready and waiting for ya big boy... :roflmao:

[koaftder]

Red, actually NOT, as the Disney factor has not even kicked in yet. The DVD is only being released today. There was no advertising yet at all. This was the CUSA factor of visitors to our site, and then clicking through to the forum link. Once the PR and ads break, we expect 1000 quests/members on the forum, at least for the first few months.

I'll probably buy the dvd just because the ad is in there.

[digitex]

It tells me Barry or Leo whichever one you are that your a bigger idiot than I thought you stupid fool... :)

The day you picked to make your pathetic little claim that it was down to a "CUSA event" just shows what total dimwit you really are as everybody here knows that day was down "SpamBots" attacking the site not anything to do with your sad little copyright infringing cesspit of a company... :)

So stick that in yer pipe and smoke it ya dunderheid... :roflmao:

I said "...most likely...." so if that's the case. i stand corrected. Still does not change the stats, and the point I was making is that there are far more normals out there in the wild than there are here.

Frank, get help. Are you able to express yourself in a normal tone, in proper English, and without the personal, vulgarity cloaked in pseudo dialect slang?.

[redrumloa]

Enough is enough, some people still insist on ignoring the TOS. No more informal warnings after this post, infractions will be issued.

Posting Guidelines (http://www.amiga.org/index.php?pageid=posting_guidelines)

No trolling.
Don't make posts that are inflammatory just to get people angry. Substance is the key to not being labeled a troll.

Blatant personal attacks are not permitted.
Criticize ideas, not people. Excessive flaming will not be tolerated. Users who verbally assault the character or person of other posters on a regular basis will be banned. Name calling is best left to grade school. Moderator's judgment applies here. "You are wrong" is not a personal attack; "You are an idiot" is. "You do not have all of the facts" is not a personal attack; "you are obviously clueless" is. These are generalized examples, but you get the idea.

Posts of a libellous nature are not allowed.
Everyone has a right to their own opinion, whether you think it right or wrong. Posting false information about an individual is not only bad form, but could become a serious problem, both for the poster, and for Amiga.org itself.

Members will not publicly question a moderator's decision.
All moderation concerns should be addressed in a private manner, either by private messaging or emailing the moderator in question.

[Iggy]

really??? :)
"...So £99-109 is more than enough for just a case "

BEFORE YOU OPEN YOUR MOUTH, TRY TO ENGAGE YOUR BRAIN FOR 2 SECONDS, AND THINK ABOUT WHAT THIS REALLY COSTS:

custom injection mold ABS case, that is available nowhere on this planet, a custom keyboard (like DAS), with custom dual shot injection molded spherical keys, Cheery Blue key switches, metal UL bracket for dvd & hdd, dual SATA & Power cable harness(custom), LED/Power switch combo, rubber feet, custom logo badge (not a sticker) 40mm x 10mm high velocity silent fan, 42 format card reader w/ USB port, case plates for dvd opening and card reader, screws and cable ties, full color glossy printed showcase package carton, shipping carton, labor to assemble (not little Chinese kids), 100% assembly in USA, printed insert material, incoming freight charges, ADD TO THAT AN AMORTIZED AMOUNT FOR THE COST OF DESIGN & MOLD CONSTRUCTION (ALMOST 100K US$) AND THE FCC & UL CERTIFICATIONS.

"..crap motherboard specs worth about £50-75 AT BEST."

GO PRICE OUT AN INTEL ATOM DUAL CORE 525 @ 1.8 GHZ, WITH ON BOARD DC POWER CONVERSION (CRITICAL) WITH NVIDEA ION2 GRAPHICS, WiFi/n BLUTOOTH on board or mini pcie card,EXTERNAL 90 WATT 12 Vdc universal power adaptor, incoming freight. YOU WILL NOT FIND THIS ANYWHERE, REGARDLESS OF THE MANUFACTURER, FOR LESS THAN OVER US$200+. AND THAT DOES NOT INCLUDE MEMORY!

THE ACTUAL KEYBOARD CANNOT BE BOUGHT FOR LESS THAN $135-$160, AND THAT WILL STILL NOT GIVE YOU THE CUSTOM EXACT STYLE AND SHAPE AND COLOR OF THE ORIGINAL C64, JUST UPDATED WITH MODERN FUNCTIONS.

NOW YOU KNOW WHY THIS MACHINE IS PRICED AS IT IS. BUY IT OR DON'T..JUST BE AWARE OF WHAT IT IS YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT, BEFORE YOU FORM YOUR OPINIONS AND MAKE RIDICULOUS COMMENTS.

All caps is hostile and unpleasant.
FCC certification procedures no longer require testing, rather the manufacturer merely states that they guarantee the product meets FCC regulation.
UL testing is not mandatory.
Every other manufacturer of hardware faces similar tasks listed in this rant.
Similar spec systems without a C64 look alike case (but supplied with Windows 7).

1) Acer Aspire Revo $344.99

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16883103297

2)Acer Veriton $434.99

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16883103324

Or about $165 to $255 less.

[crawff]

Where is this commercial being played? anyone know what channels or what country?



Franko is a secret C=USA agitator (paid by Barry Altman to stir up controversy)

[Franko]

-MODERATED-

PS: Red... Issue away I've had my say the truth is out, to be honest I dont give a **** about this anymore... :D

[Kremlar]

As mostly a lurker I have to say the following:

- Franko and most of the other trolls on here come off as mentally challenged people with no lives.

- I think it's great that someone is actually doing SOMETHING with the Commodore & Amiga names. Bottom line is that no one else was, and taking a stab at the x86 market probably offers the best chance of success.

- I have to question the market for a C64-style chassis. It has some retro appeal, but in reality who would want to use something like that every day? Nevermind the lack of ergonomics and non-standard keyboard layout, but is there a market for the computer-in-a-keyboard form factor anymore? I don't think so, but perhaps I'm wrong!

Anyway, best of luck Commodore USA. And Barry - why do you bother coming here and arguing with the trolls? You'll never convince them of the obvious - it's a waste of time.

[crawff]

Are you calling Franko a troll?


Franko is a secret C=USA agitator (paid by Barry Altman to stir up controversy)

[Kremlar]

Similar spec systems without a C64 look alike case (but supplied with Windows 7).

1) Acer Aspire Revo $344.99

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16883103297 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16883103297)

2)Acer Veriton $434.99

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16883103324 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16883103324)

Or about $165 to $255 less.

No ****. Are you seriously wondering why Commodore USA can't match the price of an Acer spec for spec?

No one competes with low-end PCs from Acer/Dell/HP anymore unless they have something unique. There's no profit to be made. Commodore USA's selling point is the Commodore name, unique case, and retro appeal.

Commodore USA is banking that people will pay a premium for that. Will they? I think some will. We'll find out.

Heck, if some people are willing to pay a much bigger premium for sub-standard, slow hardware based on an obsolete platform just to run an obscure OS that is incompatible with the vast majority of software and hardware out there... perhaps Commodore USA has a chance!

[Argo]

Think about this....the all time record for most users -=Moderated=- on Amiga.org was 497 on July28,2010, most likley because of a CUSA event. And how many years has this forum been up???

Last night our forum was holding at between 725-800 quests/members, and the forum is only a few weeks old.

Just what does this tell you?

Marketing Hype does wonderful things. Now you just have to deliver. Though I think we are not what your targeted market should be.

@Everyone, Let's keep it civil!

[Iggy]

No ****. Are you seriously wondering why Commodore USA can't match the price of an Acer spec for spec?

No one competes with low-end PCs from Acer/Dell/HP anymore unless they have something unique. There's no profit to be made. Commodore USA's selling point is the Commodore name, unique case, and retro appeal.

Commodore USA is banking that people will pay a premium for that. Will they? I think some will. We'll find out.

Heck, if some people are willing to pay a much bigger premium for sub-standard, slow hardware based on an obsolete platform just to run an obscure OS that is incompatible with the vast majority of software and hardware out there... perhaps Commodore USA has a chance!

I think I've mentioned in previous posts that the Commodore and Amiga names aren't important to me (while the seem to be a point of religious reverence to others).
The case is cute. But not two hundred dollars worth of cute. And retro appeal is more than appearance.

As to obscure OS' and incompatible systems, that just a hobby. And when I use an X86 PC, its just an appliance.

However, I will agree with you that C=USA is likely to sell a few of these. There probably is a market for them. And the introductory price has to leave some room for profit for third parties. Also, in time it could go down.

You also forgot to mention (as a selling point) the promise of a future Commodore OS (with emulation of older hardware).

But as to "Are you seriously wondering why Commodore USA can't match the price of an Acer spec for spec", absolutely. Computers are mere commodity items these days. You can attempt to market with unique features, but unless those features offer utility (rather than the intangibles you've mentioned) you're going to have difficulty justifying a price premium.

[Franko]

@everyone, let's keep it civil!

-moderated-

[Etho]

OK I'm an OS4 guy but that advert was preaty cool! If they can maintain a standard then maybe people willl come around.

[mongo]

Think about this....the all time record for most users -=Moderated=- on Amiga.org was 497 on July28,2010, most likley because of a CUSA event. And how many years has this forum been up???

Last night our forum was holding at between 725-800 quests/members, and the forum is only a few weeks old.

Just what does this tell you?

Most of the threads on your forum have under 1000 views.

It tells me that most of the guests on your site aren't people.

Or that they're really not all that interested in your site.

[haywirepc]

I think its interesting that their "ceo" is posting here but has not answered any of the questions raised by this "commercial".

Like did they have the permission from disney legally to use the footage from Tron that they used?

Where will this commercial air except for youtube?

Given their track record of plagerism, stolen graphics, half truths and hype so far, I don't believe they actually secured the rights to use this footage in one of their "commercials" which is certainly made for commercial gain.

Steven

[crawff]

I wonder how many are online right now...

[Kremlar]

But as to "Are you seriously wondering why Commodore USA can't match the price of an Acer spec for spec", absolutely. Computers are mere commodity items these days. You can attempt to market with unique features, but unless those features offer utility (rather than the intangibles you've mentioned) you're going to have difficulty justifying a price premium.

I disagree. Many things allow a company to sell at a price premium. Aesthetics is one of them. There are companies out there whose business is selling $200+ computer cases. Do they really offer any utility above a standard $40 PC clone case? I'd say no, but nonetheless people do pay a premium for them.

What I don't understand is why so many people on here feel the need to attack Commodore USA's business plan so emotionally. These same people would rather have Commodore USA invest in AmigaOS 4.x, PowerPC, AROS, whatever... Do these people really think that's a more sound business plan?

Let the market decide.

[Franko]

Well I'm off to watch some paint dry, much more exiting than waiting for Barry to type something or for my ban to happen (they usually wait till I log off before doing that)... :D

So I guess the next time I try to log in I wont be able to, oh well I've had my fun and said what needed to be said, so ban away chaps... :)

Ta, Ta... ;)

[Karlos]

Think about this....the all time record for most users on Amiga.org was 497 on July28,2010, most likley because of a CUSA event. And how many years has this forum been up???
...
Just what does this tell you?

It tells me that you haven't factored in the obvious point that the current incarnation of the site has only been up a comparatively short time compared to the total lifespan of the site.

And no, "most users online" statistics were not part of the migration dataset when the site moved from xoops to vbulletin.

[redrumloa]

It tells me that you haven't factored in the obvious point that the current incarnation of the site has only been up a comparatively short time compared to the total lifespan of the site.

And no, "most users online" statistics were not part of the migration dataset when the site moved from xoops to vbulletin.

True. Now that you mention it, I remember there were somewhere in the ballpark of 1,300 online for the Gary Hare live Q&A.

[Karlos]

True. Now that you mention it, I remember there were somewhere in the ballpark of 1,300 online for the Gary Hare live Q&A.

I think I remember that one too :)

[Iggy]

I disagree. Many things allow a company to sell at a price premium. Aesthetics is one of them. There are companies out there whose business is selling $200+ computer cases. Do they really offer any utility above a standard $40 PC clone case? I'd say no, but nonetheless people do pay a premium for them.

What I don't understand is why so many people on here feel the need to attack Commodore USA's business plan so emotionally. These same people would rather have Commodore USA invest in AmigaOS 4.x, PowerPC, AROS, whatever... Do these people really think that's a more sound business plan?

Let the market decide.

Personally, If I pay a premium for a computer case, it due to features I want not aesthetic appeal. So yes, it had better have an advantage in features or i'm not paying a premium for it.

But I do believe there are people who would buy solely on that basis.

And I don't think that the people that are attacking C=USA would want the company involved in their hobbyist pursuits either. You're way of base there.

Further, I don't view my statements of personal preference in anyway as an attack.
I think C=USA has a fairly good business plan targeting practical systems that would be of greater use to the average computer user.
Apparently the systems don't appeal to some diehard Amiga fans.
So what? That's little more than a small percentage of their potential market.

[Plaz]

I think I just saw a major ban hammer fall in here between page refreshes.

Plaz

[Kremlar]

And I don't think that the people that are attacking C=USA would want the company involved in their hobbyist pursuits either. You're way of base there.

So what DO they want?

[Darrin]

I think I just saw a major ban hammer fall in here between page refreshes.

Plaz

What a surprise.

Well, that's this forum totally compromised.

[Digiman]

So what DO they want?

For that price? An i7 processor for a start ;)

[redrumloa]

So what DO they want?

They want to see the complete destruction of the company since the company has "the name" and does not share the same vision as they do for what an "Amiga" should be.

[Darrin]

They want to see the complete destruction of the company since the company has "the name" and does not share the same vision as they do for what an "Amiga" should be.

That's bollocks.

It would have been fine to see Commodore products, but the bastardizing of the (still active) Amiga name and the initial conduct of Barry and his minions is where the trouble started.

I guess the last thing Barry wanted was an Amiga site where people were openly questioning his products and motives. The purge begins...

[Pyromania]

No purge here.

[Digiman]

They want to see the complete destruction of the company since the company has "the name" and does not share the same vision as they do for what an "Amiga" should be.

Amiga = 9 pin joystick plug + Paula chip + ability to load 3.5" Amiga game disks

Amiga <> x86 motherboard + emulator required to run any 68k code.

Simple really ;)

Escom went bust due to make believe pricing compared to PCs on sale....Fake C= copied that :roflmao:

[Karlos]

I guess the last thing Barry wanted was an Amiga site where people were openly questioning his products and motives. The purge begins...

What purge? People have left of their own accord, nobody has been banned - which given the tone of some of the recent threads is a small miracle. Personally, I'd much rather people stay.

Let me tell you, it'll take some hell of a purge to shift my a*se from the site.

I might not be as vocal about it as some, but I'm not particularly impressed with CUSA so far either. I do have to give them credit for bringing a product to market and securing what seems to be some decent advertising, but the C64x is certainly not something I'd be inclined buy. Nor are any of the other systems currently mentioned on their website. Furthermore, their bad first impressions have stuck for me, particularly the dodgy website, "borrowing" other people's artwork and so on. However, I suspect they care about my disdain for all that as much as I do for their opinion.

The ragequit mentality of certain people here over this episode is disappointing. I honestly thought that most people that react like that would have done so already at some point. It isn't as if the community has never experienced frisson like it before.

[Digiman]

No purge here.

Is that a warning to Red? :hammer:

[Digiman]

What purge? People have left of their own accord, nobody has been banned - which given the tone of some of the recent threads is a small miracle. Personally, I'd much rather people stay.

Let me tell you, it'll take some hell of a purge to shift my a*se from the site.

I might not be as vocal about it as some, but I'm not particularly impressed with CUSA so far either. I do have to give them credit for bringing a product to market and securing what seems to be some decent advertising, but the C64x is certainly not something I'd be inclined buy. Nor are any of the other systems currently mentioned on their website. Furthermore, their bad first impressions have stuck for me, particularly the dodgy website, "borrowing" other people's artwork and so on. However, I suspect they care about my disdain for all that as much as I do for their opinion.

The ragequit mentality of certain people here over this episode is disappointing. I honestly thought that most people that react like that would have done so already at some point. It isn't as if the community has never experienced frisson like it before.

Commodore's UK C64 "elephantine 64k memory" adverts in the UK were genius, the ASA put the kybosh on them! :(

[Iggy]

So what DO they want?

Good question. I think in each niche market it comes down to control of the direction that their system of choice heads toward.
That's why there are several different Amiga related hobbyist communities.
Basically, a flavor for any preference.

That's one of the reason's it not important for C=USA to market to or worry about these people. They represent a small target of highly opinionated hard sells.
Better to go after the larger general market.

[Karlos]

For that price? An i7 processor for a start ;)

Not a good fit for the breadbox case though. Imagine the cooling problems...

[WolfToTheMoon]

Not a good fit for the breadbox case though. Imagine the cooling problems...

a mobile edition i5, maybe even a i7... would be pretty hot, still.

[Karlos]

a mobile edition i5, maybe even a i7... would be pretty hot, still.

Also consider that any i7 would have to be accompanied by a GTX580 class graphics card to rouse my interest. If it hasn't got more cores / higher compute rating than the one I have, I'm not interested :lol:

[Digiman]

Not a good fit for the breadbox case though. Imagine the cooling problems...

Performance/£ I meant given the price for a non notebook form factor :)

[Digiman]

Also consider that any i7 would have to be accompanied by a GTX580 class graphics card to rouse my interest. If it hasn't got more cores / higher compute rating than the one I have, I'm not interested :lol:

Quite. It's inferior to my Dell 17" notebook which cost 1/2 the price but plays PS3 quality games.

[digitex]

I think its interesting that their "ceo" is posting here but has not answered any of the questions raised by this "commercial".

Like did they have the permission from disney legally to use the footage from Tron that they used?

Where will this commercial air except for youtube?

Given their track record of plagerism, stolen graphics, half truths and hype so far, I don't believe they actually secured the rights to use this footage in one of their "commercials" which is certainly made for commercial gain.

Steven

Are you kidding? Did you look on the Disney/Tron site partners page? Did you see the Commodore logo, right next to CocaCola? Did you think that it got there by magic? Do you think the world's largest media company knows what is going on with their IP? This is a partnering/co:branding campaign, NOT advertising. We each use the IP assets, and jointly promote our products together. OOOOO, I sure hope they don't look at our site and see all those clips we used from the unedited stock footage they sent us last year, before the movie was even released :)

What else do you want to keep bringing up? The Commodore logo, that is now ours? The Amiga logo, that too. How about the fantasy case shot...yup, still there also. Ahhh, here's one...the huge glass 3D Boing ball on our OS page....still there, along with other work created by the same artist, for us.

The commercials will be airing everywhere...just keep watching TV...you'll see them...maybe,even where you live, if you're in a major market.

Now Steven, why not tell us all about yourself, so I can have the opportunity to examine and comment incorrectly about every facet of your life? I would really love to know what you do for a living...and see some of your work product. How about telling us all about your lifetime achievements...I'm sure there is something there that I would enjoy ripping apart. What's that? hmmmm, no reply??? C'mon, fair is fair...I don't hide behind an avatar like all of you (with some exceptions). You all know my number..my e-mail etc. It's so easy for all you to type these disgusting comments, knowing that you're hidden in your little life, behind a keyboard. Try saying these things in real life...to my face..or anyone else's, for that matter. You never would...or could.

anybody else?

[trekiej]

I can not afford it. : )

[SysAdmin]

A lot of resources time and money went into recreating the C64 case which does look out of place in 2011. If it sells well fine, then that venture can be called a success. I hope that such resources would also be wisely put into an FPGA based mini Amiga system. Amiga in a joystick or something like that. Now that would sell a ton and make whoever did it very rich.

[Digiman]

Still have no idea how my friend did the C64DTV design and still got it into such a low budget price point. She is a genius, a retro genius indeed!

[Belial6]

A lot of resources time and money went into recreating the C64 case which does look out of place in 2011. If it sells well fine, then that venture can be called a success. I hope that such resources would also be wisely put into an FPGA based mini Amiga system. Amiga in a joystick or something like that. Now that would sell a ton and make whoever did it very rich.

Well, you could just put the RetroReplay in a C64x case, and there you go. Done.

The only thing I am not sure of is what kind of keyboard it using. I would assume that it is plugging into an internal USB port, so that might give you a little trouble. I wonder if it is compatible with the USB to PS/2 adapters...

[persia]

At $300 I might buy it as a gag, but the thing is going to be so difficult to type on that $600 is way too much for a gag.

[digitex]

Still have no idea how my friend did the C64DTV design and still got it into such a low budget price point. She is a genius, a retro genius indeed!

She's more than a genius. Spoke to Jeri 2 weeks ago, and what a story that is. And the best part is....... the story isn't over yet!!
:)

[mongo]

Now Steven, why not tell us all about yourself, so I can have the opportunity to examine and comment incorrectly about every facet of your life? I would really love to know what you do for a living...and see some of your work product. How about telling us all about your lifetime achievements...I'm sure there is something there that I would enjoy ripping apart. What's that? hmmmm, no reply??? C'mon, fair is fair...I don't hide behind an avatar like all of you (with some exceptions). You all know my number..my e-mail etc. It's so easy for all you to type these disgusting comments, knowing that you're hidden in your little life, behind a keyboard. Try saying these things in real life...to my face..or anyone else's, for that matter. You never would...or could.

anybody else?

You gonna beat him up at recess?

You really need to have a PR person doing your talking for you, because almost every time you talk you come across as being incredibly unprofessional and kind of an -=Moderated=-. It doesn't reflect well on your business.

[Darrin]

What purge? People have left of their own accord, nobody has been banned - which given the tone of some of the recent threads is a small miracle. Personally, I'd much rather people stay.

Let me tell you, it'll take some hell of a purge to shift my a*se from the site.

I might not be as vocal about it as some, but I'm not particularly impressed with CUSA so far either. I do have to give them credit for bringing a product to market and securing what seems to be some decent advertising, but the C64x is certainly not something I'd be inclined buy. Nor are any of the other systems currently mentioned on their website. Furthermore, their bad first impressions have stuck for me, particularly the dodgy website, "borrowing" other people's artwork and so on. However, I suspect they care about my disdain for all that as much as I do for their opinion.

The ragequit mentality of certain people here over this episode is disappointing. I honestly thought that most people that react like that would have done so already at some point. It isn't as if the community has never experienced frisson like it before.

Glad to hear it. You're right, we're giving them far too much attention and some people thrive on it (usually ones with a small penis). :D

[Darrin]

anybody else?

Yeah, me. Bring it on little man. Of course, I'm sure you'll be cowering behind a lawyer.

God, as a spokesman you're pathetic. Better leave it to Dammy.

[Argo]

Commodore USA is banking that people will pay a premium for that. Will they? I think some will. We'll find out.

Heck, if some people are willing to pay a much bigger premium for sub-standard, slow hardware based on an obsolete platform just to run an obscure OS that is incompatible with the vast majority of software and hardware out there... perhaps Commodore USA has a chance!


So, why do some people want them to go? Going by what members here have described other companies and products in our little Amiga market, it sounds like they fit right in.

Really though, do the retro Atari users bitch this much about Atari?

[Argo]

-moderated-


Franko, franko, franko.... sigh.

[redrumloa]

Yeah, me. Bring it on little man. Of course, I'm sure you'll be cowering behind a lawyer.

God, as a spokesman you're pathetic. Better leave it to Dammy.

@Darrin
And you were wondering why Barry gets nasty? How would you respond if this was directed at you:confused:

[Iggy]

At $300 I might buy it as a gag, but the thing is going to be so difficult to type on that $600 is way too much for a gag.

$300 is definitely on the low side. Even I don't think they should go that low. While it is an Intel Atom, its the highest performing Atom tied to an Nvidia GPU.
From the systems I've previously compared a $400 to $450 price might be more realistic.

[dammy]

She's more than a genius. Spoke to Jeri 2 weeks ago, and what a story that is. And the best part is....... the story isn't over yet!!
:)

:banana:

[haywirepc]

Its regrettable that their ceo wants to attack me for asking valid questions. So far, his "company" has been caught in so many lies, half truths and deceptions, I'm not sure why he's suprised when people question him about things now.

If they didn't have such a bad track record of stealing graphics, announcing then cancelling products and so on people would not question
what they say, slapping stickers on existing computers and renaming them and so on.

The least they can expect is people questioning what they do.

I'm looking forward to seeing 30 million dollars worth of advertising.
I'm looking forward to seeing all these new computers they have announced, especially the ones that will actually require assembly
instead of just slapping stickers on exciting products.

I'm actually ooking forward to seeing commodore os 1.0

An interesting sidenote, I already own a "vic slim", which I got from the real manufacturer. It is a great little computer, really, but I suggest that you get it direct from the real manufacturer at 119.95$ instead of paying 400$ for it with a commodore sticker slapped on it. Thats quite a markup for a sticker.

Nuff said.

Steven

[dammy]

$300 is definitely on the low side. Even I don't think they should go that low. While it is an Intel Atom, its the highest performing Atom tied to an Nvidia GPU.
From the systems I've previously compared a $400 to $450 price might be more realistic.

While they could lower the cost with AMD Fusion (zacate should be out next month), you have to factor in beyond the components, like assemble fees, insurance, end user tech support, marketing, and then profit for not only for C=USA but for the retailers selling the C64x as well that goes into figuring a MSRP and a MAP. There are just so many hands in the pie, that profit is whittled down to nothing, then the US government takes it's 38.5% and whatever the state charges for corp taxes.

Considering this is a start up and a quick production timeline, the prices are within reason. I'm sure Leo will be working on cost reduction for production over the Summer (well, Winter for him).

[digitex]

Its regrettable that their ceo wants to attack me for asking valid questions. So far, his "company" has been caught in so many lies, half truths and deceptions, I'm not sure why he's suprised when people question him about things now.

If they didn't have such a bad track record of stealing graphics, announcing then cancelling products and so on people would not question
what they say, slapping stickers on existing computers and renaming them and so on.

The least they can expect is people questioning what they do.

I'm looking forward to seeing 30 million dollars worth of advertising.
I'm looking forward to seeing all these new computers they have announced, especially the ones that will actually require assembly
instead of just slapping stickers on exciting products.

I'm actually ooking forward to seeing commodore os 1.0

An interesting sidenote, I already own a "vic slim", which I got from the real manufacturer. It is a great little computer, really, but I suggest that you get it direct from the real manufacturer at 119.95$ instead of paying 400$ for it with a commodore sticker slapped on it. Thats quite a markup for a sticker.

Nuff said.

Steven

You are such a pathetic liar. I'll buy 10,000 of them right now from you for that price. Why would you say such insane things that are so easily shown as lies. Do get pleasure from saying things just to see the reaction from people here who don;t know any better?

[Iggy]

You are such a pathetic liar. I'll buy 10,000 of them right now from you for that price. Why would you say such insane things that are so easily shown as lies. Do get pleasure from saying things just to see the reaction from people here who don;t know any better?

Absolutely! Under $120 dollars? Obviously the poster intended to insult everyone's intelligence.

While they could lower the cost with AMD Fusion (zacate should be out next month), you have to factor in beyond the components, like assemble fees, insurance, end user tech support, marketing, and then profit for not only for C=USA but for the retailers selling the C64x as well that goes into figuring a MSRP and a MAP. There are just so many hands in the pie, that profit is whittled down to nothing, then the US government takes it's 38.5% and whatever the state charges for corp taxes.

Considering this is a start up and a quick production timeline, the prices are within reason. I'm sure Leo will be working on cost reduction for production over the Summer (well, Winter for him).

The comparisons I've made so far are only based on hardware specs and in no way relate to the market realities or scales of production that each company faces.
Further, if you'd followed my original post, the comparisons were based on utility.
Obviously the C64x does have some appeal that goes beyond its utility.

Those comparisons are only really valid if you're looking for a computing appliance.

[Franko]

(Quick RED moderate this one... Oh sorry... forgot... you cant anymore... ;))
-=Moderation Removed=-
-=User Banned=-

Stay out of the CUSA topics and don't start any.

See you in three days, Franko

[Argo]

Not a good fit for the breadbox case though. Imagine the cooling problems...

I'm imagining the melting case problems!!!

[Franko]

Franko, franko, franko.... sigh.

Argo, argo, argo.... WHeeeeeee :)

[Darrin]

Argo, argo, argo.... WHeeeeeee :)

Hey Frank, what's up with this?

Franko has chosen not to receive private messages or may not be allowed to receive private messages. Therefore you may not send your message to him/her.

If you are trying to send this message to multiple recipients, remove Franko from the recipient list and send the message again.

???

[mongo]

You are such a pathetic liar. I'll buy 10,000 of them right now from you for that price. Why would you say such insane things that are so easily shown as lies. Do get pleasure from saying things just to see the reaction from people here who don;t know any better?

OK Barry, lets see how honest you are. How much do you pay for the VIC Slim Standard? You know, the one you sell for $395.

[dammy]

OK Barry, lets see how honest you are. How much do you pay for the VIC Slim Standard? You know, the one you sell for $395.

Come on, that is not reasonable to ask him what his profit margin is. I don't see anyone challenging A-EON or ACube on what they are purchasing their hardware and software/support for.

[mongo]

Come on, that is not reasonable to ask him what his profit margin is. I don't see anyone challenging A-EON or ACube on what they are purchasing their hardware and software/support for.

A-EON and ACube aren't slapping a sticker on someone else's product and selling it.

If Barry is going to act outraged when someone claims that he is ripping people off with a ridiculous markup for putting a sticker on a product, he should be more than happy to prove them wrong.

The problem is that Barry actually is ripping people off with a ridiculous markup for putting a sticker on a product.

[Kronos]

I don't see anyone challenging A-EON or ACube on what they are purchasing their hardware and software/support for.

Huh ?? I advice opening your eyes than ......

Prices (and wether they are inflated) is at the center of pretty much every X1000/SAM discussion in the last year. It may come from a different angle, but in the end it's the same, specs and prices are at odds and people are questioning if they are getting shafted.


Bout that CyperCrap screenless laptop being available for 120$, I'd say that about the right number after someone failed to market them at "normal" prices (very likely given their crappy nature) and has now resorted market them through secondary channels.

Mind you I probraly wouldn't even buy one if it went even lower.


Bout the commercial, all it proves is that either Barry or one of his partners is prepared to burn major $$$ on this adventure. WalMart or suchlike buying them in bulk also means very little cos they will simply send them back if they can't move the stock fast enough.

[digitex]

OK Barry, lets see how honest you are. How much do you pay for the VIC Slim Standard? You know, the one you sell for $395.

Our prices are clearly indicated on our site. I called darrin a liar; he is, and it has not been proven otherwise. Simply ask him to post a pic of his "Vic Slim", and a copy of his invoice. he can't, so he won't. The end.

[Franko]

Are you kidding? Did you look on the Disney/Tron site partners page? Did you see the Commodore logo, right next to CocaCola? Did you think that it got there by magic? Do you think the world's largest media company knows what is going on with their IP? This is a partnering/co:branding campaign, NOT advertising. We each use the IP assets, and jointly promote our products together. OOOOO, I sure hope they don't look at our site and see all those clips we used from the unedited stock footage they sent us last year, before the movie was even released :)

What else do you want to keep bringing up? The Commodore logo, that is now ours? The Amiga logo, that too. How about the fantasy case shot...yup, still there also. Ahhh, here's one...the huge glass 3D Boing ball on our OS page....still there, along with other work created by the same artist, for us.

The commercials will be airing everywhere...just keep watching TV...you'll see them...maybe,even where you live, if you're in a major market.

Now Steven, why not tell us all about yourself, so I can have the opportunity to examine and comment incorrectly about every facet of your life? I would really love to know what you do for a living...and see some of your work product. How about telling us all about your lifetime achievements...I'm sure there is something there that I would enjoy ripping apart. What's that? hmmmm, no reply??? C'mon, fair is fair...I don't hide behind an avatar like all of you (with some exceptions). You all know my number..my e-mail etc. It's so easy for all you to type these disgusting comments, knowing that you're hidden in your little life, behind a keyboard. Try saying these things in real life...to my face..or anyone else's, for that matter. You never would...or could.

anybody else?

Ok Big Man... I called your bluff (and my post got deleted) you pay for the ticket (it'll need to be via a nice luxury liner and first class of course, I don't travel any other way across the pond) and I'll be over to take you up in person on your challenge, now if you'd be so kind to elaborate on this wee challenge I'll gladly get myslef ready for it, to quote your good self "You never would... or could"... :roflmao:

[Darrin]

Bout the commercial, all it proves is that either Barry or one of his partners is prepared to burn major $$$ on this adventure. WalMart or suchlike buying them in bulk also means very little cos they will simply send them back if they can't move the stock fast enough.

If Walmart sell them then it better had be cheap. Expensive overpriced items need to go on sale at Best Buy (or similar) where they do "store credit" agreements.

Walmart PCs start off at around $299 and 99.999% of the customers are just looking at the price, not the specs.

[Darrin]

Our prices are clearly indicated on our site. I called darrin a liar; he is, and it has not been proven otherwise. Simply ask him to post a pic of his "Vic Slim", and a copy of his invoice. he can't, so he won't. The end.

Where did I claim to have an invoice?

The VIC was an easy find by typing "Zero Footprint PC" into Google. I never mentioned the "slim", but someone else posted a link to another site selling them.

Get your facts right Barry-boy.

Never mind though, I'll send off an email to someone in China and ask if they can track down the manufacture and find a unit cost over there. Might be interesting...

[dammy]

A-EON and ACube aren't slapping a sticker on someone else's product and selling it.

The Vic Pro is a customize case (externally and internally) for C=USA, just like how A-EON has a customized case for their A1X1K. We can go into what other people's parts go into a system if you want. Vic slim, I don't know much about so it might be a white label product.

If Barry is going to act outraged when someone claims that he is ripping people off with a ridiculous markup for putting a sticker on a product, he should be more than happy to prove them wrong.

From where I am from, the law says the accuser has to show the proof.

The problem is that Barry actually is ripping people off with a ridiculous markup for putting a sticker on a product.

I'd say its up to you to prove it then. Buy the product, buy what you think is it's original system at whatever price you find it at and then open the two cases up and show us the proof, part's model number for part's model number. Till then, you are just doing a hit and run job on Barry.

[mongo]

Our prices are clearly indicated on our site. I called darrin a liar; he is, and it has not been proven otherwise. Simply ask him to post a pic of his "Vic Slim", and a copy of his invoice. he can't, so he won't. The end.

I didn't ask you for your price, I asked you for your cost. I know what your price is, I mentioned it in my post. Would you like me to tell people what your cost is too? Or are you honest enough to tell them yourself?

[Darrin]

The Vic Pro is a customize case (externally and internally) for C=USA, just like how A-EON has a customized case for their A1X1K. We can go into what other people's parts go into a system if you want. Vic slim, I don't know much about so it might be a white label product.

From where I am from, the law says the accuser has to show the proof.

I'd say its up to you to prove it then. Buy the product, buy what you think is it's original system at whatever price you find it at and then open the two cases up and show us the proof, part's model number for part's model number. Till then, you are just doing a hit and run job on Barry.

LOL. I can see it now:

2 identical looking machines, except one has a Commodore sticker on it and costs $300 more. The machines are opened up and everyone says "ooh, the cheap no-brand one is exactly the same" and Dammy protests "no it isn't, it has a Western Digital hard drive and we use a Toshiba! It isn't apples with apples!"

[Franko]

From where I am from, the law says the accuser has to show the proof.

And where is that exactly... DisneyLand... :laughing:

Strange laws where you come from, here you just make the accusations to the relevant authorities and they investigate it... :)

Go and fetch Barry a coffee or something cos I think he's nodding off just sitting there waiting till someone tells him what to say next... :D

[WolfToTheMoon]

I didn't ask you for your price, I asked you for your cost. I know what your price is, I mentioned it in my post. Would you like me to tell people what your cost is too? Or are you honest enough to tell them yourself?

How many business' reveal their cost? Not many... it's called a trade secret, I believe. If something is too expensive for you, here's a suggestion, don't buy it, simple as that...
I'm sure you could buy a similar cheaper computer from China. But then you wont be paying numerous licenses, testing, customer support... It's comparing apples to oranges.

[Franko]

How many business' reveal their cost? Not many... it's called a trade secret, I believe. If something is too expensive for you, here's a suggestion, don't buy it, simple as that...
I'm sure you could buy a similar cheaper computer from China. But then you wont be paying numerous licenses, testing, customer support... It's comparing apples to oranges.

No... comparing apples and oranges is comparing two real and genuine things... :)

Not like comparing one cheap Chinese import against another cheap Chinese import that your going to charge mugs ridiculous prices for and claim it's superior cos you've stuck Commodore badge on it... :D

Customer Support... :roflmao:

I'd love to hear that...

Customer... it's about this expensive C64x I just bought, where's the OS !!!

CUSA Customer Services (AKA Leo, all round handyman)... we're in charge get used to and like your product or else...next...

You lot make me laugh... :roflmao:

[Iggy]

$395 actually seems fairly reasonable.

[mongo]

I'd say its up to you to prove it then. Buy the product, buy what you think is it's original system at whatever price you find it at and then open the two cases up and show us the proof, part's model number for part's model number. Till then, you are just doing a hit and run job on Barry.

Is this proof enough for you?

[mongo]

$395 actually seems fairly reasonable.

For a $185 computer?

[Franko]

Is this proof enough for you?

Neat... :)

[mongo]

How many business' reveal their cost? Not many... it's called a trade secret, I believe. If something is too expensive for you, here's a suggestion, don't buy it, simple as that...
I'm sure you could buy a similar cheaper computer from China. But then you wont be paying numerous licenses, testing, customer support... It's comparing apples to oranges.

What licenses? What testing? What customer support? I don't see any mention of customer support on CUSA's website.

[Darrin]

Is this proof enough for you?

Oh! Nice prices and they're not even empty cases!

Considering that actual VIC "fat" model has been on sale since 2003 (according to some ads I've found), the cost per case must be really low by now. It makes you wonder if someone picked up a few thousand of them in a liquidation sale.

One of the advantages of having worked on the mainland in China is that you get your eyes opened to what items we take for granted really cost to maufacture.

For instance, you can buy almost exact replica Rolex watches at RETAIL in China complete with box and (forged) certificate of authenticity from $15 up (probably less is you haggle). I got one for a laugh and many years later the damn thing still works!

I also picked up a knock-off set of "Big Bertha II" Calloway golf clubs complete with travel bag for a whopping $180, again at RETAIL.

Imagine what the warehouse prices are or even the actual manufacturing costs!

That said, I'm a businessman too and in all fairness you have to mark products up to make money. Especially when you claim to have spent $30,000,000 on "advertising".

That means that if you sell 1000 units then you'll need to add an extra $30,000 on average to each product's price to cover that. Taking that into consideration, I guess these Commodore prices are very fair. :)

[Darrin]

What licenses? What testing? What customer support? I don't see any mention of customer support on CUSA's website.

Every computer sold has Barry's phone number attached to a sticky lable pasted on the bottom.

Unfortunately if you call it then Barry justs insults you, tells you that he knows where you live from your product registration form and threatens to "kick your ass" if you don't bugger off. Well actually, he invites you to return your product to him in Florida in person because he's not going to actually travel to see you (or even kick your ass as his poor limp wrists might snap). :D

[dammy]

Is this proof enough for you?

What part of this post didn't you read? http://www.amiga.org/forums/showpost.php?p=629038&postcount=176 I already said the Vic Slim was possible a white label box, what more do you want?

Now on the Vic Pro, that is in a customized AIO system, internally and externally. Your proof for Vic Pro being a white label system is? Even the photos of the Vic Pro and what it was based on look different. But you already knew that, right?

[dammy]

What licenses? What testing? What customer support? I don't see any mention of customer support on CUSA's website.

I know the C64x will have live tech support (think it's 24/7 support but it might be only during normal business hours here in the US). Not sure on the Vic series will have live tech support or not. There is a lot of information that has not been posted yet to the web site. I expect it to be posted as time rolls on.

[mongo]

What part of this post didn't you read? http://www.amiga.org/forums/showpost.php?p=629038&postcount=176 I already said the Vic Slim was possible a white label box, what more do you want?

Now on the Vic Pro, that is in a customized AIO system, internally and externally. Your proof for Vic Pro being a white label system is? Even the photos of the Vic Pro and what it was based on look different. But you already knew that, right?

The VIC Pro is a Cybernet ZPC-GX31. What do you think is customized about it?

[Franko]

I know the C64x will have live tech support (think it's 24/7 support but it might be only during normal business hours here in the US). Not sure on the Vic series will have live tech support or not. There is a lot of information that has not been posted yet to the web site. I expect it to be posted as time rolls on.

:roflmao:

You crack me up Dammy... :laughing:

Yes folk we at CUSA offer full 24/7 support (only during business hours and subject to Barry's whim)... :roflmao:

You should have been a stand up comedian Dammy... Oh forgot... you are... :lol:

[tone007]

I wonder if the VicPro's user manual will be a rebranded Cybernet manual, complete with Cybernet's 800 number for tech support!

[mongo]

I wonder if the VicPro's user manual will be a rebranded Cybernet manual, complete with Cybernet's 800 number for tech support!

http://www.commodoreusa.net/j/PhoenixOwnersGuide.pdf

They edited the Cybernet manual a little. It has CUSA's phone # and refers you to a part of the website that doesn't exist.

They also changed the copyright in the manual to ©Copyright 2010 Commodore USA, LLC. I'm not sure how that works. Can I take something that is copyrighted by someone else, change a few words and copyright it myself? Is that legal? Because if it is, I've got some editing to do.

[Amiga_Nut]

Come on, that is not reasonable to ask him what his profit margin is. I don't see anyone challenging A-EON or ACube on what they are purchasing their hardware and software/support for.

Fair point, but the X1000 is a terrible grossly inefficient and overly expensive design when they could have whispered "xbox360 motherboard" into IBM's ear and saved $1000 on the price. Most of that is because they have made terrible design decisions in their self-made bespoke technology. C= USA are either just slapping stickers on existing AIO PCs from China or at best putting stock x86 motherboards inside their bespoke cases. Quite a difference really considering the design of the case was already done for them in 1980 by the designer of the original VIC-20 casing mind :)

Ho hum.

[dammy]

The VIC Pro is a Cybernet ZPC-GX31. What do you think is customized about it?

No, it's based on that Cybernet model which Cybernet customized as per C=USA request.

[mongo]

No, it's based on that Cybernet model which Cybernet customized as per C=USA request.

Answer the question.

What do you think is customized about it?

[dammy]

http://www.commodoreusa.net/j/PhoenixOwnersGuide.pdf

They edited the Cybernet manual a little. It has CUSA's phone # and refers you to a part of the website that doesn't exist.

They also changed the copyright in the manual to ©Copyright 2010 Commodore USA, LLC. I'm not sure how that works. Can I take something that is copyrighted by someone else, change a few words and copyright it myself? Is that legal? Because if it is, I've got some editing to do.

Now the Phoenix was more then likely a white label but we are talking about the Vic Pro, not the Phoenix. Vic Pro is a customized version of the Phoenix created by and produced by Cybernet. If I'm wrong, I'm sure Leo will correct me on that one.

[mongo]

Now the Phoenix was more then likely a white label but we are talking about the Vic Pro, not the Phoenix. Vic Pro is a customized version of the Phoenix created by and produced by Cybernet. If I'm wrong, I'm sure Leo will correct me on that one.

http://www.commodoreusa.net/CUSA_VICPro.aspx

Click on the Gallery tab then download the "VIC-Pro Owners Guide" from the link.

Nothing customized about the VIC Pro beyond the standard options Cybernet offers, and a sticker, of course.

[dammy]

Answer the question.

What do you think is customized about it?

It was getting late at night for me and it's been couple of months now since Barry showed us the difference, but the exterior is different, the two have different mold colors. Something about black and silver around the keyboard were different on the exterior between the two. I seem to remember that the mobo position was moved, think it was in reference to a new mobo with WIFI. Barry wanted to make it very clear that the Vic Pro was different then the Cybernet model.

[Franko]

It was getting late at night for me and it's been couple of months now since Barry showed us the difference, but the exterior is different, the two have different mold colors. Something about black and silver around the keyboard were different on the exterior between the two. I seem to remember that the mobo position was moved, think it was in reference to a new mobo with WIFI. Barry wanted to make it very clear that the Vic Pro was different then the Cybernet model.

Do I detect excuses here... :)

and even a wee hint of you sounding as though with Barry demanding this and Barry demanding that of you, that you're beginning to wonder just what you've got yourself into... hmmm... :)

Do yourself & the rest of us a favour Dammy & bail out while you still can... ;)

[tone007]

If only the differences were clear! Sounds like possibly a different revision that Cybernet will most likely also be selling, though usually WiFi is a MiniPCI addon (redesigning a motherboard to have it integrated seems like a waste.)

$100 less, without WiFi:

http://cgi.ebay.com/Zero-Footprint-PC-Duo-2-93GHz-3MB-Processor-2GB-SD_W0QQitemZ280487322532QQcategoryZ37821QQcmdZView ItemQQ_trksidZp5197.m7QQ_trkparmsZalgo%3DLVI%26itu %3DUCI%26otn%3D4%26po%3DLVI%26ps%3D63%26clkid%3D82 66865179676164712

Hey look, they don't seem to be selling at that price, either.

[dammy]

http://www.commodoreusa.net/CUSA_VICPro.aspx

Click on the Gallery tab then download the "VIC-Pro Owners Guide" from the link.

Nothing customized about the VIC Pro beyond the standard options Cybernet offers, and a sticker, of course.

I think I just now noticed they mixed and match the Vic PRO and the Cybernet model pictures on the web page. Notice some show black surrounding the keyboard, top heat vents, and the glide mat area and some show silver instead. Silver one has the C= logo on it which is the Vic-Pro, the black is the standard Cybernet model. Leo needs to redo the images used.

[Franko]

I think I just now noticed they mixed and match the Vic PRO and the Cybernet model pictures on the web page. Notice some show black surrounding the keyboard, top heat vents, and the glide mat area and some show silver instead. Silver one has the C= logo on it which is the Vic-Pro, the black is the standard Cybernet model. Leo needs to redo the images used.

More doubt's creeping in eh Dammy... :)

Bail out while you still can... :)

[mongo]

It was getting late at night for me and it's been couple of months now since Barry showed us the difference, but the exterior is different, the two have different mold colors. Something about black and silver around the keyboard were different on the exterior between the two. I seem to remember that the mobo position was moved, think it was in reference to a new mobo with WIFI. Barry wanted to make it very clear that the Vic Pro was different then the Cybernet model.

Do a Google image search for ZPC-GX31, you'll see that they come in different colours.

Cybernet offers 9 different WiFi options for the ZPC-GX31. Do you really think they are going to design and make a new motherboard just for Barry?

VIC Pro motherboard : http://www.commodoreusa.net/j/PhoenixBig8.jpg

Cybernet ZPC-GX31 motherboard : http://www.cybernetman.com/files/siteContent/photo_downloads/2/Bottom_layer_ZPC_look.jpg

Note that both say "MS-7517 VER : 1.0".

[tone007]

Hey look, MiniPCI WiFi. That's about a $20 option.

[mongo]

I think I just now noticed they mixed and match the Vic PRO and the Cybernet model pictures on the web page. Notice some show black surrounding the keyboard, top heat vents, and the glide mat area and some show silver instead. Silver one has the C= logo on it which is the Vic-Pro, the black is the standard Cybernet model. Leo needs to redo the images used.

So, you're saying the VIC Pro looks like this : http://www.cybernetman.com/files/siteContent/photo_downloads/2/Top_layer_ZPC_look.jpg

[haywirepc]

More excuses, half truths, and bold faced lies.

Everything they are selling except this c64 retro cased one is a sticker slapped on an existing product for a 25-50% markup. Hey, printing those commodore stickers is expensive, stop bitching!

After paying 30 million dollars for advertising, they are running out of money for stickers. Everyone just buy their crap and stop revealing their lies and bull****, your getting on their nerves.

[mongo]

More excuses, half truths, and bold faced lies.

Everything they are selling except this c64 retro cased one is a sticker slapped on an existing product for a 25-50% markup. Hey, printing those commodore stickers is expensive, stop bitching!

After paying 30 million dollars for advertising, they are running out of money for stickers. Everyone just buy their crap and stop revealing their lies and bull****, your getting on their nerves.

100% markup for the VIC Slim.

[tone007]

VIC Pro motherboard : http://www.commodoreusa.net/j/PhoenixBig8.jpg

Cybernet ZPC-GX31 motherboard : http://www.cybernetman.com/files/siteContent/photo_downloads/2/Bottom_layer_ZPC_look.jpg

I wonder if Cybernet sells them without the CYBERNET logo stamped into the heatsink or if they paid the CUSA photoshop guy overtime to clean it up on their picture.

[dammy]

So, you're saying the VIC Pro looks like this : http://www.cybernetman.com/files/siteContent/photo_downloads/2/Top_layer_ZPC_look.jpg

Now that is an exact outer match.

[Digiman]

It was getting late at night for me and it's been couple of months now since Barry showed us the difference, but the exterior is different, the two have different mold colors. Something about black and silver around the keyboard were different on the exterior between the two. I seem to remember that the mobo position was moved, think it was in reference to a new mobo with WIFI. Barry wanted to make it very clear that the Vic Pro was different then the Cybernet model.

VIC-20 is white, Apple made white computers cool......so why isn't it white if it was made to order?

Methinks your designer is teh rubbish :)

[Digiman]

So, you're saying the VIC Pro looks like this : http://www.cybernetman.com/files/siteContent/photo_downloads/2/Top_layer_ZPC_look.jpg

Anybody got a sick bag? :confused:

[mongo]

Now that is an exact outer match.

That's the Cybernet ZPC-GX31.

Now that we've established that the outside is exactly the same, and the inside is exactly the same, do you still believe what Barry told you?

[Iggy]

If only the differences were clear! Sounds like possibly a different revision that Cybernet will most likely also be selling, though usually WiFi is a MiniPCI addon (redesigning a motherboard to have it integrated seems like a waste.)

$100 less, without WiFi:

http://cgi.ebay.com/Zero-Footprint-PC-Duo-2-93GHz-3MB-Processor-2GB-SD_W0QQitemZ280487322532QQcategoryZ37821QQcmdZView ItemQQ_trksidZp5197.m7QQ_trkparmsZalgo%3DLVI%26itu %3DUCI%26otn%3D4%26po%3DLVI%26ps%3D63%26clkid%3D82 66865179676164712

Hey look, they don't seem to be selling at that price, either.

The unit listed on Ebay includes Windows.
The C=USA model only lists "OPERATING SYSTEM COMPLIANCE:"
I don't see WIFI listed in the Vic Pro specs, only "1 Gigabit (GbE) Fast Ethernet, using Realtek RTL 8168B/8111C".

[tone007]

The WiFi shows up as included when you view the items in the store.

[AppleHammer]

They spelt "colour" wrong.

[Iggy]

The WiFi shows up as included when you view the items in the store.

Then they should have included it in the specs where they list networking instead of just mentioning the Realtek nic.

[Iggy]

They spelt "colour" wrong.

No the British spell that wrong.

[redrumloa]

I didn't ask you for your price, I asked you for your cost. I know what your price is, I mentioned it in my post. Would you like me to tell people what your cost is too? Or are you honest enough to tell them yourself?

That is a loaded question. Do you think material cost per unit is the only cost? I cringe to think how many units they have to sell to cover the Disney advertising. It would be like asking A-Eon how much each X1000 will cost in materials alone and ignoring the engineering costs.

[AppleHammer]

No the British spell that wrong.

:lol: I knew I'd reel someone in with that!

[redrumloa]

It was getting late at night for me and it's been couple of months now since Barry showed us the difference, but the exterior is different, the two have different mold colors. Something about black and silver around the keyboard were different on the exterior between the two. I seem to remember that the mobo position was moved, think it was in reference to a new mobo with WIFI. Barry wanted to make it very clear that the Vic Pro was different then the Cybernet model.

There was something completely different with the PCI riser IIRC. indicating a different board.

[tone007]

I cringe to think how many units they have to sell to cover the Disney advertising.

Co-branding!!1!1 PARTNERSHIP!1!1~!

[redrumloa]

More excuses, half truths, and bold faced lies.

Everything they are selling except this c64 retro cased one is a sticker slapped on an existing product for a 25-50% markup. Hey, printing those commodore stickers is expensive, stop bitching!

After paying 30 million dollars for advertising, they are running out of money for stickers. Everyone just buy their crap and stop revealing their lies and bull****, your getting on their nerves.

Wow, I don't seem to remember this level of Venom out of you about Amigakit! Amigakit doesn't have an advertising budget, they advertise for free by spamming Amiga Websites. Amigakit buys cheap white box products like mice and keyboards, slaps a Boing Ball label on it and jacks the price up 100%. Where's the anger and vitriol towards Amigakit:confused:

[Iggy]

Co-branding!!1!1 PARTNERSHIP!1!1~!

Winning!

[Franko]

Why is Barry hanging around here just now doing nothing... is he waiting to hand out sweets to the kiddies... :)

[mongo]

That is a loaded question. Do you think material cost per unit is the only cost? I cringe to think how many units they have to sell to cover the Disney advertising. It would be like asking A-Eon how much each X1000 will cost in materials alone and ignoring the engineering costs.

I think you should refrain from commenting on things you know less than nothing about. You cannot buy advertising on anything that Disney does. They don't sell advertising. They are the largest media company in the world. There is a huge difference between "advertising" & "partnering". - Barry Altman

http://www.amiga.org/forums/showpost.php?p=627586&postcount=203

[mongo]

There was something completely different with the PCI riser IIRC. indicating a different board.

Either the board is the same, or they are not selling the same product they are advertising on their website.

So, either Barry is a liar or a fraud. Which is it?

[Franko]

Someone give Barry a poke, he's been hanging round this thread for ages and hasn't said a thing, the old guy might have dozed off or be dead or summit... :)

Yooo Hooo... Barry... time to wake up it's hot chocolate & biccies time... coooeeee... :)

[gazgod]

Wow, I don't seem to remember this level of Venom out of you about Amigakit! Amigakit doesn't have an advertising budget, they advertise for free by spamming Amiga Websites. Amigakit buys cheap white box products like mice and keyboards, slaps a Boing Ball label on it and jacks the price up 100%. Where's the anger and vitriol towards Amigakit:confused:

moobunny ;)

[redrumloa]

moobunny ;)

Well Moobunny hates everything, including grandmothers and small puppies:lol:

[eliyahu]

Someone give Barry a poke, he's been hanging round this thread for ages and hasn't said a thing, the old guy might have dozed off or be dead or summit... :)

Yooo Hooo... Barry... time to wake up it's hot chocolate & biccies time... coooeeee... :)
i suspect he's rather busy, actually. according to quote he gave the new york times (http://bits.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/04/06/the-new-commodore-64-updated-with-its-old-exterior/?ref=technology), his web site is averaging five registrations every second. that's over 430,000 every day:

“The response has been completely dramatic,” Mr. Altman said. “We’ve been averaging about five registrations per second on our Web site. This is from people giving us their name and e-mail address to be kept abreast of updates on the new Commodore.”staggering, really. i wonder if this is true or he was misquoted; either way it certainly gives the impression of massive interest out there. i mean, wow. with this level of interest, i imagine we'll start seeing user reviews of this thing pretty quickly after they ship to the pre-order customers.

in fact, if they have so many potential and actual customers, i don't know why barry or any of the CUSA principals would bother hanging around here anyway. even though this is the biggest amiga forum out there, we're rather dwarfed by the new 'commodore' enthusiasts. and this is even before the TV commercials air.

-- eliyahu

[redrumloa]

istaggering, really. i wonder if this is true or he was misquoted; either way it certainly gives the impression of massive interest out there. i mean, wow.

And then there is the Slashdot (http://hardware.slashdot.org/story/11/04/06/1924207/The-New-Commodore-64) effect.

[mongo]

i suspect he's rather busy, actually. according to quote he gave the new york times (http://bits.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/04/06/the-new-commodore-64-updated-with-its-old-exterior/?ref=technology), his web site is averaging five registrations every second. that's over 430,000 every day

Great! In a month and a half, everyone who ever bought a C64 will have registered.

I don't believe it, do you?

The article also says "Barry Altman, president and chief executive of Commodore USA, said he purchased the Commodore trademark in September of last year", but he didn't buy anything. He got a license to use it. Big difference.

[number6]

Great! In a month and a half, everyone who ever bought a C64 will have registered.

I don't believe it, do you?

The article also says "Barry Altman, president and chief executive of Commodore USA, said he purchased the Commodore trademark in September of last year", but he didn't buy anything. He got a license to use it. Big difference.


Correct. And there are numerous errors in many of the "news" articles. Perhaps the one copied over the most times is about the Commodore OS being included, when it is not.
Journalism is not what it used to be.

#6

[Iggy]

Curse!
http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20080221214011/athfwiki/images/2/2b/AquaTeen_LoveMummy.jpg

[runequester]

Correct. And there are numerous errors in many of the "news" articles. Perhaps the one copied over the most times is about the Commodore OS being included, when it is not.
Journalism is not what it used to be.

#6

Journalism is dead. The internet just means there's more corpses ;)

[redrumloa]

The article also says "Barry Altman, president and chief executive of Commodore USA, said he purchased the Commodore trademark in September of last year", but he didn't buy anything. He got a license to use it. Big difference.

Actually if I remember correctly he got exclusive world wide rights, so yes he purchased it.

[runequester]

This is nothing on CUSA (for a change :p )

From the NY Times article:

The Commodore can run the Microsoft Windows operating system or a propriety Commodore OS.

No mention of linux. Unable to spell "proprietary".

I guess I can run a news paper too, if I can get 5th graders to write my articles.

[mongo]

Actually if I remember correctly he got exclusive world wide rights, so yes he purchased it.

Commodore® trademark used under exclusive worldwide license by Commodore USA, LLC for its line of AIO (All-In-One) keyboard computers, and is the trademark of Commodore Licensing, BV.

He did not buy it. He does not own it. He has a license to use it for his all-in-one keyboard computers. He does not have a license to use it for anything else.

[jorkany]

This is nothing on CUSA (for a change :p )

From the NY Times article:

The Commodore can run the Microsoft Windows operating system or a propriety Commodore OS.

No mention of linux. Unable to spell "proprietary".

I guess I can run a news paper too, if I can get 5th graders to write my articles.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/propriety

pro·pri·e·ty
   /prəˈpraɪɪti/ Show Spelled[pruh-prahy-i-tee] Show IPA
–noun, plural -ties.
1.
conformity to established standards of good or proper behavior or manners.
2.
appropriateness to the purpose or circumstances; suitability.
3.
rightness or justness.
4.
the proprieties, the conventional standards of proper behavior; manners: to observe the proprieties.
5.
Obsolete . a property.
6.
Obsolete . a peculiarity or characteristic of something.




(kidding! just kidding!) :D

[dammy]

That's the Cybernet ZPC-GX31.

Now that we've established that the outside is exactly the same, and the inside is exactly the same, do you still believe what Barry told you?

OK, I'm wrong. I was extremely tired by that time of night (and I had to travel home yet) and as such, I didn't remember the conversation correctly. My fault, no one to blame but me. Barry was talking about the primary ODM/OEM which would be making the new Vics for long term production. I was shown Cybernet's and that is where I got screwed up.

Flame away, I deserve it. :(

[Franko]

OK, I'm wrong. I was extremely tired Flame away, I deserve it. :(

You seem to be using that excuse a lot lately Dammy, what you doing that's making you so tired in BarryLand, I'm beginning to worry about your health... :(

Perhaps a nice long vacation might help, I would gladly recommend some places where you could go... :)

[mongo]

OK, I'm wrong. I was extremely tired by that time of night (and I had to travel home yet) and as such, I didn't remember the conversation correctly. My fault, no one to blame but me. Barry was talking about the primary ODM/OEM which would be making the new Vics for long term production. I was shown Cybernet's and that is where I got screwed up.

Flame away, I deserve it. :(

redrumloa remembered the conversation the same way you did.