Prophet Mohammed - Cartoons issue

[HotIce]

Islam is a merciful religion, and all what is wanted from such cartoons is to lessen the respect of Islam. Islam never means harm for anyone, beside it was noticed that they are mocking and making Islam shown as ridiculous. As you all can see, there is no one can defense about Islam, minority lives there. I only ask god to show the justice, and uncover the hidden issues that all Islam's enemies prepared for and still preparing. Holy Quran is the only reference that can and will prove all that matter.


Best regards,
Sam.

N.B: Mohammed as a name means The person who always thanks God whatever happened for him even if he passed thru very bad conditions.

[Cymric]

If you became a member of A.org solely to post this little text twice (!) in defense of Islam and the Qu'ran, then I pity you greatly. I kindly suggest you take your evangelical preachings elsewhere, and stop trying to find truth in an ancient religious text which in this day and age should only be remembered by historians---if at all.

To show that I am completely impartial to the 'minority' that is Islam, please be so kind as to look up this thread (http://www.amiga.org/forums/showthread.php?t=14022) and read the last two messages: I treat christianic evangelicals exactly the same.

[Karlos]

Thought. If someone joined soley to post the virtues of atheism or any other such view in a similar fashion, what sort of reception would they get?

[Speelgoedmannetje]

Karlos wrote:
Thought. If someone joined soley to post the virtues of atheism or any other such view in a similar fashion, what sort of reception would they get?Matters on their history of spamming, I think.

[Cymric]

Posted as a first post in this CH forum, using similar language as HotIce and goliath, the same. Although I very much doubt that an atheist will come barging in here and launch a tirade against religion, it's not the 'atheist way', so to speak. (It doesn't do evangelicism.)

Keep in mind that it is not just what is said, it is also how it is said, and the context in which it is said. HotIce clearly joined A.org to in the context of a discussion on a few mildly humourous cartoons featuring Mohammed. That, to me, is a strange reason to be joining a forum dedicated to a retrocomputer. In addition, the discussion was already clearly over, with you providing us with a somewhat opposite but informative view. (I had forgotten about the issue, to be honest---the cartoons weren't very good nor memorable.)

HotIce's answer is defensible and in context until it gets to the point where he begins asking his god for justice and that hidden issues 'enemies of islam are preparing for' be uncovered. That is not the standard talk A.org members unleash upon each other; it is however the standard talk for someone who simply wants to preach the supremeness of his religion.

The same goes for goliath, by the way. Although he didn't use such language, his intent was very much the same.

[HotIce]

I thank you all for your cooperation, but before everything, all of you have misunderstood my point, it’s not about enthusiasm, though it’s about expressing my individual thoughts and notions regarding people who made such cartoons. Anyhow, thanks for making sarcasm of my name too, and any other things. But, maybe I was not able to say it as you wanted to understand. I thought it’s a free discussion since you all live in open minded countries and people can say things to discuss.

[bloodline]

Karlos wrote:
Thought. If someone joined soley to post the virtues of atheism or any other such view in a similar fashion, what sort of reception would they get?

As an "atheist" myself... I can't think of any virtues atheism has. It's not something one can use as a means of support or as a "guiding path", it is simply a term used to describe my particular understanding of the universe...

Maybe you wanted to say humanist instead of atheist?

http://www.gamebanshee.com/vampirebloodlines/walkthrough/explosivebeginning.php#null

This is here because my Email is broken and I want to get this game help website to my home computer... feel free to ignore it :-)

[Karlos]

@bloodline

Well, I guess it depends. One could argue a virtue of atheism is that it encourages complete lack of superstition and belief in only what can be determined logically and rationally. I also imagine that you can be an atheist and yet not a humanist (for instance, I could logically justify the killing of another person that is competing with me for some critical resource as an atheist, but not as a humanist).

[Karlos]

@HotIce

Don't get all bent out of shape about it. Speaking as a muslim myself I can honestly say that I found the cartoons misrepresentive, borderline racist and not remotely funny (and trust me, I like a good laugh as much as the next guy).

You can always expect a degree of cynicism on a place like this when your first post is in defence of a religious or political viewpoint.

You can expect even more cynicism, nay outright hostility if your first post begins with "hey yo"...

[Speelgoedmannetje]

Karlos wrote:
@HotIce

Don't get all bent out of shape about it. Speaking as a muslim myself I can honestly say that I found the cartoons misrepresentive, borderline racist and not remotely funny (and trust me, I like a good laugh as much as the next guy).

You can always expect a degree of cynicism on a place like this when your first post is in defence of a religious or political viewpoint.

You can expect even more cynicism, nay outright hostility if your first post begins with "hey yo"... That last post of 'HotIce' seemed to me quite a non-sequitor, as if it was generated by a spambot.

[bloodline]

Karlos wrote:
@bloodline

Well, I guess it depends. One could argue a virtue of atheism is that it encourages complete lack of superstition and belief in only what can be determined logically and rationally.


Is that a virtue? Belief and superstition have served us fairly well over the past 20,000 years... There are people who will never be able to think logically and rationally, but give them a simple superstition to describe a danger and they will be fine... of course one could argue that having that sort of person out of gene pool would be an advantage ;-)


I also imagine that you can be an atheist and yet not a humanist (for instance, I could logically justify the killing of another person that is competing with me for some critical resource as an atheist, but not as a humanist).

Yes, they are quite independant.. thought the two do generally go hand in hand... as a rule of thumb.

bloodline wrote:

Karlos wrote:
@bloodline

Well, I guess it depends. One could argue a virtue of atheism is that it encourages complete lack of superstition and belief in only what can be determined logically and rationally.


Is that a virtue? Belief and superstition have served us fairly well over the past 20,000 years... There are people who will never be able to think logically and rationally, but give them a simple superstition to describe a danger and they will be fine... of course one could argue that having that sort of person out of gene pool would be an advantage ;-)


I also imagine that you can be an atheist and yet not a humanist (for instance, I could logically justify the killing of another person that is competing with me for some critical resource as an atheist, but not as a humanist).

Yes, they are quite independant.. thought the two do generally go hand in hand... as a rule of thumb.

Stalin, Pol Pot..... ;-)

[HotIce]

@Speelgoedmannetje

No ... it's not a spam, but that's what you want to feel ... and you want it to be spam, but I myself, never used to post such things, it's bad, and not useful at all, I think we are mature enough to realize that ...

[HotIce]

@Karlos

Thanks alot buddy, I can touch kindness in your speech, actually I found A.org by coincidence, and I was not looking for it particularly, that's why my first post was not starting with hey yo ;->

[Speelgoedmannetje]

HotIce wrote:
@Speelgoedmannetje
I think we are mature enough to realize that ...I think we should be mature enough to read each other posts, try to understand the content of the posts, to be able to react appropriately, to be able to ignore dumb comics, and to be somehow interested in the subject of the site you're posting on.

[odin]

HotIce wrote:
@Karlos

Thanks alot buddy, I can touch kindness in your speech, actually I found A.org by coincidence, and I was not looking for it particularly, that's why my first post was not starting with hey yo ;->

And which Amiga was your first btw? :-).

[bloodline]

HotIce wrote:
@Karlos

Thanks alot buddy, I can touch kindness in your speech, actually I found A.org by coincidence, and I was not looking for it particularly, that's why my first post was not starting with hey yo ;->

You know, I find it sad to think that you have trawled the internet to find something you don't like and then post a reaction to it... on a site you know nothing about. I don't think you would be particularly happy if I came to a site of your choosing and started sprouting crap about the Amiga...

If you have a problem with some content then I suggest you raise your concerns with the creator/owner/poster of that content privately.

[nadoom]

i think mandatory questions about amiga on signup to amiga.org would be the way forward..

[metalman]

nadoom wrote:
i think mandatory questions about amiga on signup to amiga.org would be the way forward..

I think some Google ads would be appropriate, so Wayne could have made some $$$ on the 36,000 hits on the thread

[Matti]

I would never mock anyone cause they have their beliefs. But People are getting killed or even kill themselves over a book written thousands of years ago. Is that rational?
Is merciful the same as forgiving? as a matter of fact there is a prayer in the holy quran that mohammed made once he got mocked. It says that he forgives those who make fun of him cause he knows that Allah is with him. If he is able to do that. Then why aren´t the rest of the muslims able to think the same? Don´t use this as an excuse to get your frustrations out. If printing the cartoons was an abuse of the liberty of press, then the burning embasseys and the riots are an abuse of the cartoons. onyl difference is. your own peple are getting killed while doing it. And the danes don´t wish for the dead of nobody. Your governments blew this out of proportions. And you yourself are getting killed in the act. Logical thinking. Its just not worth it.

HotIce wrote:
Islam is a merciful religion, and all what is wanted from such cartoons is to lessen the respect of Islam. Islam never means harm for anyone, beside it was noticed that they are mocking and making Islam shown as ridiculous. As you all can see, there is no one can defense about Islam, minority lives there. I only ask god to show the justice, and uncover the hidden issues that all Islam's enemies prepared for and still preparing. Holy Quran is the only reference that can and will prove all that matter.


Best regards,
Sam.

N.B: Mohammed as a name means The person who always thanks God whatever happened for him even if he passed thru very bad conditions.

[Karlos]

metalman wrote:

I think some Google ads would be appropriate, so Wayne could have made some $$$ on the 36,000 hits on the thread

Yeah, I coudln't help noticing the thread had a massive read count. Is it the most read topic on amiga.org? :-o

[metalman]

Karlos wrote:

metalman wrote:

I think some Google ads would be appropriate, so Wayne could have made some $$$ on the 36,000 hits on the thread

Yeah, I coudln't help noticing the thread had a massive read count. Is it the most read topic on Amiga.org? :-o

I suspect that since the thread was started here before the controversy hit the big time, when people entered the keywords "Mohammed Cartoons" into a search engine, the Aorg thread was probably near the top.

metalman wrote:

Karlos wrote:

metalman wrote:

I think some Google ads would be appropriate, so Wayne could have made some $$$ on the 36,000 hits on the thread

Yeah, I coudln't help noticing the thread had a massive read count. Is it the most read topic on Amiga.org? :-o

I suspect that since the thread was started here before the controversy hit the big time, when people entered the keywords "Mohammed Cartoons" into a search engine, the Aorg thread was probably near the top.

Or the secret services of every soveriegn nation on earth have been spidering all occurences of "Mohammed Cartoons". ;-)

[cecilia]

hey kids, here's (http://powerofnarrative.blogspot.com/2006/02/get-your-propaganda-right-here-cartoon.html) and interesting blog article on this issue. actually nicely written. good points and all that. :-D

[Karlos]

metalman wrote:

I suspect that since the thread was started here before the controversy hit the big time, when people entered the keywords "Mohammed Cartoons" into a search engine, the Aorg thread was probably near the top.

Just for a laugh I had a go but were not that notorious yet :-D

[metalman]

Karlos wrote:

metalman wrote:

I suspect that since the thread was started here before the controversy hit the big time, when people entered the keywords "Mohammed Cartoons" into a search engine, the Aorg thread was probably near the top.

Just for a laugh I had a go but were not that notorious yet :-D

We are no longer that notorious, A LOT has been written on Mohammed cartoons in the last few days, there were only 250 more views on the thread between today and yesterday. :-)

[metalman]

cecilia wrote:
hey kids, here's (http://powerofnarrative.blogspot.com/2006/02/get-your-propaganda-right-here-cartoon.html) and interesting blog article on this issue. actually nicely written. good points and all that. :-D

"propagandistic crap"

The cartoon story has a number of interesting angles, but it requires a myopic anti-American perspective to turn it into a story about racism.

There are some obvious differences between the two stories. Newsweek printed a claim about mistreatment of the Koran, that was false. These false claims resulted in Muslim riots.

Jyllands-Posten printed some political cartoons that caricature Muslim jihadists as Mohammed. Danish Imam's created and circulated 3 extra derogatory pictures, not published anywhere else, to incite Muslim riots.

Danish Imam's created and circulated 3 extra derogatory pictures, not published anywhere else, to incite Muslim riots.

So people keep saying, but I have not seen these pictures anywhere.

Can someone provide links to them, or are these claims just more anti-Muslim propaganda?

[Seehund]

Karlos wrote:

metalman wrote:

I suspect that since the thread was started here before the controversy hit the big time, when people entered the keywords "Mohammed Cartoons" into a search engine, the Aorg thread was probably near the top.

Just for a laugh I had a go but were not that notorious yet :-D

I'd guess that the missionaries add "forum" to their search. Then amiga.org comes up as Google-hit #13 here. :)

[Seehund]

mdma wrote:
Danish Imam's created and circulated 3 extra derogatory pictures, not published anywhere else, to incite Muslim riots.

So people keep saying, but I have not seen these pictures anywhere.

Can someone provide links to them, or are these claims just more anti-Muslim propaganda?

Complete Imam "portfolio of hate" (http://www.ekstrabladet.dk/VisArtikel.iasp?PageID=329877) (Article in Danish, follow the "side XX" links at the bottom.)

Fake pic #1 (http://ekstrabladet.dk/grafik/nettet/tegninger38.jpg)
(Real source discovered (http://www.neandernews.com/?p=54).)

Fake pic #2 (http://ekstrabladet.dk/grafik/nettet/tegninger39.jpg)

Fake pic #3 (http://ekstrabladet.dk/grafik/nettet/tegninger40.jpg)

"More"? Where was the previous anti-Muslim propaganda?

[metalman]

HotIce wrote:
Islam is a merciful religion, and all what is wanted from such cartoons is to lessen the respect of Islam. Islam never means harm for anyone, beside it was noticed that they are mocking and making Islam shown as ridiculous. As you all can see, there is no one can defense about Islam, minority lives there. I only ask god to show the justice, and uncover the hidden issues that all Islam's enemies prepared for and still preparing. Holy Quran is the only reference that can and will prove all that matter.


Best regards,
Sam.

N.B: Mohammed as a name means The person who always thanks God whatever happened for him even if he passed thru very bad conditions.


Top 9 Signs Your Religion May Not Be So Peaceful (http://www.thenoseonyourface.com/the_nose_on_your_face/2006/02/top_9_signs_you.html)

This link is "Mohammed Image Free"!