Computers that TRIED to be an Amiga

[leirbag28]

I just think this is funny, and at the same time flattering............and at the same time quite sad to imagine how much PC's suck that they had to go this route to attempt to have the same slick design as the Amiga.


http://nfg.2y.net/games/teradrive/

http://www.uk.playright.dk/raretitel.php?id=13883

[angrybrit]

leirbag28 wrote:

http://nfg.2y.net/games/teradrive/
I wanted one real bad. :-(


...


FTW!

[alexh]

I've got a MegaPC somewhere. Saw it in 1993 in Tandy, bought it 10 years later at car boot.

[Argus]

The ST tried for years to be an Amiga....never quite got there :)

[koaftder]

Argus wrote:
The ST tried for years to be an Amiga....never quite got there :)

:lol:

[Speelgoedmannetje]

Argus wrote:
The ST tried for years to be an Amiga....never quite got there :)Though they came very close, with their Falcon (but that was designed by a few former Amiga developers)

[Speelgoedmannetje]

Btw. the sharp x68000, the Sinclair QL and the SAM Coupé were quite competitors considering h/w and so...

[TjLaZer]

The Atari Falcon030 tried to be an A1200 and it did a pretty damn good job! Actually it kicked it's arse, too bad Atari folded right at the same time!

[ajlwalker]

I always considered IBM's Aptiva home range of PCs "borrowed" the Amiga name.

Also, the last of the Amstrad 8 bits had Amstrad embossed on the case and were nice and creamy like the Amiga.

[Speelgoedmannetje]

TjLaZer wrote:
The Atari Falcon030 tried to be an A1200 and it did a pretty damn good job! Actually it kicked it's arse, too bad Atari folded right at the same time!But afaik it didn't have h/w (pre-emptive) multitasking, but software.

[Lando]

Speelgoedmannetje wrote:

TjLaZer wrote:
The Atari Falcon030 tried to be an A1200 and it did a pretty damn good job! Actually it kicked it's arse, too bad Atari folded right at the same time!But afaik it didn't have h/w (pre-emptive) multitasking, but software.

Sure, the OS was way behind (And still is - even with the latest versions) but it was all contained in ROM (no having to search through hundreds of disks to find your workbench floppy) and nobody used Workbench in 1992 anyway. I never did, and none of the friends I knew who had Amigas did. The Amiga was for playing games, watching demos, and occasionally booting up XCopy to copy the contents of your friend's disk box.

There are accelerator boards for the Falcon now with a 68060 at 100Mhz and 512MB of RAM - try doing that on an Amiga!

[Tomas]

I would not mind owning one of those amstrad megapcs...

[c64_d0c]

newer computers that TRIED to be an amiga, is the peg/morphos, so far it have faild 100% to be an amiga. the users of morphos now days is whining about a os4.0 port to their peg motherboard. becouse they have allready bougth the hw, that they think is superiority to anything else that is ppc out there..
________
Expert insurance (http://xpertinsurance.com/)

[Cyberus]

and you're saying Amiga One hasn't?
:roflmao:

[Cyberus]

leirbag28 wrote:


I just think this is funny, and at the same time flattering............and at the same time quite sad to imagine how much PC's suck that they had to go this route to attempt to have the same slick design as the Amiga.


http://nfg.2y.net/games/teradrive/


:roflmao:
Many people, especially those pesky Europeans (particularly the British), are fond of saying "Oh, yeh, the TeraDrive. Did you ever see the Amstrad PC/MegaDrive combo? Fine bit of kit that was, eh wot? Let's go down to the pub!". On the surface the two do seem to share many features. Both are PCs, with MegaDrives in them! That's pretty much where it ends, however.

:lol: :lol:

[Chain]

That Amstrad has somthin very similar to 500´s floppy

very suspicious :inquisitive:

[Speelgoedmannetje]

c64_d0c wrote:
newer computers that TRIED to be an amiga, is the peg/morphos, so far it have faild 100% to be an amiga. the users of morphos now days is whining about a os4.0 port to their peg motherboard. becouse they have allready bougth the hw, that they think is superiority to anything else that is ppc out there..Please be merciful towards *this nitpick :cry:
It should be:
Newer computers wich TRIED to be an Amiga, are the Pegasos/MorphOS computers, but so far these have failed 100%. The users of MorphOS nowadays are begging for an OS4.0 port for their Pegasos system. They think their Pegasos is superior to any other hardware wich uses PPC processors.

[Tomas]

Cyberus wrote:
and you're saying Amiga One hasn't?
:roflmao:
Like it or not, but it is a closer thing to Amiga as it was licensed by AmigaINC :-P It seems like neither of those platforms was a sucess. AmigaONE is probably no more as eyetech does not see any profit in producing more.

[coldfish]

I just think this is funny, and at the same time flattering............and at the same time quite sad to imagine how much PC's suck that they had to go this route to attempt to have the same slick design as the Amiga.

I remember both of those, I had an A500 at the time so they didnt tempt me much. I wouldve liked a ST and an X68000 though!

Ironically, nowdays the Amiga is trying to be a PC, which is just as "...funny, and at the same time flattering............and at the same time quite sad..."

[Dr_Righteous]

@coldfish

You know, that IS a good point. Tho I never saw Amiga as a game machine back in the day... It was a video workstation.

Of course since the only Amigas I ever saw were in a community TV station... :-D

Now, here we have a nice, easy-to-use computer... Friendly OS... Incredible architecture for it's time. Now we wish it had grown to be what the PeeCee has become for us (tho not what it is AGAINST us) today.

[coldfish]

@Dr_Righteous

While it would be great to see something like the Amiga still around, I've gotten used to PC architecture and now i'd never swap the hardware versatility for a closed system.

I guess the PS2 and PS3 are a sort of continuation of Amiga philosophy, where really good programmers, who know how to hit-the-hardware can get seemingly impossible performance boosts.

My favourite thing about the Amiga (and C64) was this ability. Just look at an early A500 game and compare it to the stuff we were seeing later in the machine's life! In some cases, you'd swear they were on different machines, generations apart!

Always impressive, surprising and FUN! (Let's forget that a lot of the really pretty games were unplayable :O) )

This doesnt happen so much with modern computer hardware, and maybe very rarely with console hardware, but it's less dramatic and impressive compared to those 8 and 16bit systems.

[god64]

Tomas wrote:

Cyberus wrote:
and you're saying Amiga One hasn't?
:roflmao:
Like it or not, but it is a closer thing to Amiga as it was licensed by AmigaINC :-P It seems like neither of those platforms was a sucess. AmigaONE is probably no more as eyetech does not see any profit in producing more.

none of this machines is close to be an amiga. because amiga is not only a brand or the os, it's a way to carry computers into a new area. in it's times, the amiga was always the most advanced (and one of the most expensive) computer built for home usage. neither amiga-one nor pegasos are 'most advanced' and they are cheap too. no machine will ever be able to get close to the amiga. that's why there are still so many amiga's in use. amiga is dead, and bringing things back from the dead only works in hollywood.

about the topic: i think the macintosh was a computer that tried to be an amiga... and they had pretty good points... until they decided to switch from 'trying to be an amiga' to 'trying to be an pc' recentrly :roll:

[Tomas]

I guess the PS2 and PS3 are a sort of continuation of Amiga philosophy, where really good programmers, who know how to hit-the-hardware can get seemingly impossible performance boosts.
The only problem is that the playstation is totally closed for bedroom programmers. Quite a few big software companies started out as bedroom/hobby programmers on the amiga. The only way to do that on a playstation, is by installing a modchip and even then it is not easy when it comes to the ps2.

I wish there was a similar system that was more open like the Amiga was.

[Tomas]

none of this machines is close to be an amiga. because amiga is not only a brand or the os, it's a way to carry computers into a new area. in it's times, the amiga was always the most advanced (and one of the most expensive) computer built for home usage.
I understand what you mean, but sadly it is the owner that defines what an Amiga is. If AmigaINC decided to slap the Amiga logo on a wintel pc, it would still be Amiga just because they said so.
But for me neither AmigaONE or Pegasos comes close to the classic.

no machine will ever be able to get close to the amiga. that's why there are still so many amiga's in use. amiga is dead, and bringing things back from the dead only works in hollywood.
I sadly believe the same.... :-(

[Agafaster]

no machine will ever be able to get close to the amiga. that's why there are still so many amiga's in use. amiga is dead, and bringing things back from the dead only works in hollywood.
I sadly believe the same.... :-(

I partly agree. but I have an AmigaOne, and with OS4.0 it at least feels like my 1200. only much much quicker...
can't comment on Peg/Morphos as I've never seen one.

its not dead yet, but I cant see things will be quite the same...

[Nitro]

The BeBox or BeOS for that matter.

[Argus]

@TjLazer

The Falcon seems like a nice machine, but never had the kind of expansions the A1200 has. Yes, there are expensive 68060 cards with 256Mb ram from a few niche limited production runs in France, but these only happened a few years ago. The A1200 had 68060 in 1996 and ppc by 1998 with 3d graphics cards. Many are still in use today and the ppc equipped ones should be able to run OS4. I always wanted a Falcon, alas what's the point now?

[CD32Freak]

The Atari Falcon might not had the best OS, but at least it had a built-in powersupply. One of the most annoying thing about the Amiga (500/1200/600/CD32) is the powerbrick and I think I'm not the only one :-)

[Waccoon]

I guess the PS2 and PS3 are a sort of continuation of Amiga philosophy, where really good programmers, who know how to hit-the-hardware can get seemingly impossible performance boosts.
Well, the custom chip philosophy, at least. When the Amiga 2000 was released and people started getting 020 processors and hard drives, software started crashing like mad. I know a lot of people who didn't get 020 processors just becuase of this.

Always impressive, surprising and FUN! (Let's forget that a lot of the really pretty games were unplayable :O) )
I used my Amiga mostly for graphics and music, so the OS was very important to me. I wasn't too impressed with AGA when it came out, and always felt Workbench is what really made the Amiga the system that it was.

I still don't like this "PPC RULEZ" attitude people show these days. I don't care what's inside, so long as it looks and feels like an Amiga.

In that respect, these Amiga wannabes don't attract my interest, either. :-)

its not dead yet, but I cant see things will be quite the same...
No offense, but I find it very unusual that people expect OS4 to be just like OS3. I've been using Windows for many years, and while I'm still not too happy with it, going back to OS3 is very, very difficult. Everything seems to be in the wrong place. The keyboard shortcuts don't make sense. The Windows taskbar is useful if used properly, and stacked screens in AmigaOS are a pain.

One of the most annoying thing about the Amiga (500/1200/600/CD32) is the powerbrick and I think I'm not the only one
YES! God, it really annoys me that all the new consoles have external power supplies (well, PS3 is unconfirmed at this point). I have a feeling Revolution's power supply will be as big as the console itself. Pretty or not, my Mac mini power supply annoys me, too. I so just want to chuck it on the floor, but the power cord pops out of the Mac so easily, you can't. Grr...

[Speelgoedmannetje]

Does one of the techies actually know why those psu's are that big? (or small for other systems)

[Dr_Righteous]

Actually the bulk of the BULK in the bricks is AIR! If only someone could come up with a more sleek way of placing components, to maximize cooling yet eliminate dead space.

[uncharted]

It was never the size of the PSU that was the problem, but the fact the the {bleep}ing on/off switch was on it. You couldn't get more inconvenient than that.

[prowler]

uncharted wrote:
It was never the size of the PSU that was the problem, but the fact the the {bleep}ing on/off switch was on it. You couldn't get more inconvenient than that.


I don't know. I found it quite useful. I always had the PSU on the floor under the desk and used to just turn the computer on and off with my foot :) It also had the bonus benefit of keeping your feet warm during winter.

[Turambar]

The only problem is that the playstation is totally closed for bedroom programmers. Quite a few big software companies started out as bedroom/hobby programmers on the amiga. The only way to do that on a playstation, is by installing a modchip and even then it is not easy when it comes to the ps2.

Not true. There was a full ps1 devkit available for bedroom coders later in its life (nobody remembers the yaroze but me then?) and the ps2 originally shipped with its own version of basic called yabasic.

[uncharted]

While I too enjoyed warm feet during Winter, I sadly lack the co-ordination and dexterity required to operate the switch with my foot reliably. Often I'd flick it and it wouldn't quite make it.

A number of times I gave up on the foot option and end up crawling under the desk to operate it by hand, only to smack my head when getting back out. :-(

[uncharted]

Turambar wrote:

Not true. There was a full ps1 devkit available for bedroom coders later in its life (nobody remembers the yaroze but me then?) and the ps2 originally shipped with its own version of basic called yabasic.

The Yaroze was cool, but very pricey. (It was also usable with Amigas IIRC)

playstation-basic on the other hand was just a tax dodge, hence why it's only available for PAL systems. It's sad as the PS2 had a lot of potential for having a low-cost dev kit.

[Jupp3]

One "wannabe-amiga" system that's definitely worth mentioning (I'm surprised that no-one did - yet) is Schneider EuroPC.

Released: April 1988
CPU type - 8088
CPU word length - 16*bits
CPU clock rate - 9.54*MHz
ROM Size - 32*KiB
RAM Size - 512*KiB
Maximum - RAM Size 760*KiB
Keyboard - Typewriter keyboard, QWERTZ (German) lay
Number of keys - 98
Dimensions - 84.5*x*22.0*x*6.5*cm (33.3*x*8.7*x*2.6*in)
Weight - 2.6*kg (5.7*lb)
Text modes - 80x25x16
Sound channels - 1
Sound output - Mono
I/O Ports - ISA Bus Expansion Slot, Monitor output, Parallel, Serial Port

I know, I know, it's totally pathetic compared to ANY amiga, but just check out the case!

It's got "everything in one box", including internal floppy drive (which reminds me more of Commodore 65 than A500/1200 though), even the control key is at the right place!

Oh, it also has external PSU :-D

I added image to gallery, but it probably takes some time before it appears...
And finally the photo: http://www.amiga.org/gallery/index.php?n=1281=5

[AmiGR]

...I think many people in the PC world could learn a thing or two from Eyetech's hardware engineers.

!!
1) Eyetech has no hardware engineers.
2) *WHAT*!?

3) The reason people want OS4 on the Pegasos is because they like the Pegasos hardware and they like OS4. This does not mean that they do not like MorphOS.
The PegII hardware is higher specced and cheaper than the AmigaONE and is also... AVAILABLE. Not to mention that due to the fact that it has WORKING hardware cache coherency many OSes run on it flawlessly and not only ones that were written with it in mind.

[Savan]

> Computers that TRIED to be an Amiga

The AmigaONE. No faulty warrantless crappy hardware should ever have the AMIGA name attached to it. Tried and failed all thanks to Alan Redhouse.

[uncharted]

AmiGR wrote:
...I think many people in the PC world could learn a thing or two from Eyetech's hardware engineers.

!!
1) Eyetech has no hardware engineers.
2) *WHAT*!?


I do believe that this sig is being sarcastic :-)

[Tomas]

Wow, that EuroPC looks familiar... I recall from when i was young, a friend who actually had a machine that looked very similar to this. I am not 100% sure, since my memory from those days aint the best.

[Tripitaka]

There was a SNES based PC as well but I can't think who made it (the PC bit,not the SNES).

Who said the Amiga was dead? They just lost the right to speak to me. :madashell:

[matte74]

ill think this pc will qualify

http://www.cybernetman.com/default.cfm?DocId=9000
:-o

[Hyperspeed]

Yeah I remember the Sony Net-Yaroze. It was a black Playstation that you could make crappy AMOS-style games for, it faded into obscurity.

I remember thinking at the time that the CD32 could do better with a 14Mhz processor and no 3D polygon assistance.

I would have to say that the Atari Falcon came the closest and most audacious to an Amiga clone but again it was games and multimedia that made the Amiga sell in the shops. Even though the Ataris were MIDI capable out of the box I suppose this wasn't a priority to most.

There's another thread on here about that x68000 machine, looked quite impressive and was very similar internally if not externally to the Amiga.

I would say the machine that's trying most to be an Amiga right now is the Pegasos. I also think the AmigaOne isn't a true Amiga as it has no custom hardware.

Let's look at Jeff Minter (Revenge of the Mutant Camels, Tempest 2000 etc.) - he loves obscure machines with cool hardware. He liked programming the Amiga, then the Jaguar, the rare Nuon DVD chipset, the GameCube, palm machines and alledgedly the X-Box 360 music display. Do you think the AmigaOne excites him? Cheap Korean motherboards with nothing unusual about them?

As for PSUs, how did you upgrade the Atari Falcon's when you needed to add more power draining expansions? The possible reason a lot of manufacturers make them external is so that the factories can easily swap that box when it's to be sold in another territory, also there's the question of heat (the Dreamcast & slimline PS2 suffered from this) and also the magnetic shielding needed to put a AC/DC converter near such a highly compact motherboard in use for 128-Bit machines.

[Managarm]

But can't the Falcon accept a whopping 512mb RAM upgrade far more easily than an Amga?

[Hyperspeed]

How many programs were released for the Falcon? The thing could easily make do with a 512MB hard disk, what on Earth would it need 512MB RAM for?

I've heard talk of large RAM and a 100Mhz '060... if such a thing exists... but where's the software that could utilise this? Where's the graphics card?

[A3KOne]

Hyperspeed wrote:
How many programs were released for the Falcon? The thing could easily make do with a 512MB hard disk, what on Earth would it need 512MB RAM for?

I've heard talk of large RAM and a 100Mhz '060... if such a thing exists... but where's the software that could utilise this? Where's the graphics card?


Falcon not only had (or has) better upgrades than Amiga, they cost much less. I remember running across an 060/100 board when I was looking for an 060 card for my A3000. The Cyberstorm Mk3 was $600 or so from Software Hut at the time. The Atari dealer had the 060 upgrade for the Falcon for less than half that.
There was a GFX card for it as well. I don't remember the specs.

[Seehund]

Tomas wrote:

I understand what you mean, but sadly it is the owner that defines what an Amiga is. If AmigaINC decided to slap the Amiga logo on a wintel pc, it would still be Amiga just because they said so.
But for me neither AmigaONE or Pegasos comes close to the classic.


Actually, even the Amiga trademark owners have already defined that there are no more Amigas. Remember their trademark guidelines (http://web.archive.org/web/20011225100203/amigadev.net/index.php?sid=&subpage=home&function=legal&file=tmusage)?

"2. Amiga trademarks must always be used as adjectives followed by a generic product name.
CORRECT: You’ll love the next generation of Amiga operating systems!
INCORRECT: You’ll love the next generation of Amigas!

3. Do not use the Amiga trademarks in the plural or possessive form.
CORRECT: The new Amiga operating systems are more flexible than ever!
INCORRECT: The new Amigas are more flexible than ever!"

"Amiga" according to AInc means either (1) a past computer platform from the 1980s-1990s, or (2) it's shorthand for a company called Amiga Incorporated.
Personally I agree with the obvious and undisputable (1), and I feel slightly nauseous when I see AInc use it the sense of (2). ;)

Why would anyone think it's meaningful to refer to third party hardware sold through licensed dealerships as "Amigas"?
The trademark owners don't design hardware, they don't own or buy or license any designs, they don't have any specifications or guidelines, they don't produce any hardware, they don't sell any hardware, they have no control whatsoever over hardware or the hardware market and what it should or shouldn't do. What was a Teron or Pegasos or Mac yesterday could be an AmigaWhatever tomorrow. (http://pannbe.net/ingentingbakom/pix/skoj/newamiga.jpg) If for example the producers or design owners or whatever call it quits, then "the new Amiga" is gone and there's nothing that the company which supposedly would have "decided" that it was a "new Amiga" can do about it!

Any new Amiga trademark (http://pannbe.net/ingentingbakom/pix/skoj/300dollarsticker.png) slapped on these products is meaningless. OK, in practice it means that the product is now more expensive than before and sold by a smaller and less reputable distributor, but other than that it's the same Teron/Pegasos/Mac/XYZ as before.

The Amiga is dead. People have had a decade to deal with that fact now. Nobody's trying to bring it back, other than in rhetoric and deceptive marketing.

Now if AmigaOS or any of its "clones" will survive is an entirely different question!

[koaftder]

Seehund wrote:

Tomas wrote:

I understand what you mean, but sadly it is the owner that defines what an Amiga is. If AmigaINC decided to slap the Amiga logo on a wintel pc, it would still be Amiga just because they said so.
But for me neither AmigaONE or Pegasos comes close to the classic.


Actually, even the Amiga trademark owners have already defined that there are no more Amigas. Remember their trademark guidelines (http://web.archive.org/web/20011225100203/amigadev.net/index.php?sid=&subpage=home&function=legal&file=tmusage)?

"2. Amiga trademarks must always be used as adjectives followed by a generic product name.
CORRECT: You’ll love the next generation of Amiga operating systems!
INCORRECT: You’ll love the next generation of Amigas!

3. Do not use the Amiga trademarks in the plural or possessive form.
CORRECT: The new Amiga operating systems are more flexible than ever!
INCORRECT: The new Amigas are more flexible than ever!"

"Amiga" according to AInc means either (1) a past computer platform from the 1980s-1990s, or (2) it's shorthand for a company called Amiga Incorporated.
Personally I agree with the obvious and undisputable (1), and I feel slightly nauseous when I see AInc use it the sense of (2). ;)

Why would anyone think it's meaningful to refer to third party hardware sold through licensed dealerships as "Amigas"?
The trademark owners don't design hardware, they don't own or buy or license any designs, they don't have any specifications or guidelines, they don't produce any hardware, they don't sell any hardware, they have no control whatsoever over hardware or the hardware market and what it should or shouldn't do. What was a Teron or Pegasos or Mac yesterday could be an AmigaWhatever tomorrow. (http://pannbe.net/ingentingbakom/pix/skoj/newamiga.jpg) If for example the producers or design owners or whatever call it quits, then "the new Amiga" is gone and there's nothing that the company which supposedly would have "decided" that it was a "new Amiga" can do about it!

Any new Amiga trademark (http://pannbe.net/ingentingbakom/pix/skoj/300dollarsticker.png) slapped on these products is meaningless. OK, in practice it means that the product is now more expensive than before and sold by a smaller and less reputable distributor, but other than that it's the same Teron/Pegasos/Mac/XYZ as before.

The Amiga is dead. People have had a decade to deal with that fact now. Nobody's trying to bring it back, other than in rhetoric and deceptive marketing.

Now if AmigaOS or any of its "clones" will survive is an entirely different question!


I wonder if anybody has ever blasted themselves when they came to the realization that amiga was over.